Covenants we need

Black Separation Covenant - allows you to invade people who separate their summons right before beating the boss.

Because seriously, *** those people.

People do that? What reason could there possibly be to do that?

I should clarify, they use them in a boss fight but right before the final blow they separate. I think it gives them more souls.

I don't think it actually works that way though, does it? Do you get less souls if you win with phantoms?

I'm not saying it's justified either way.

you do in fact get the same amount of souls for killing a boss with phantoms. thats not the problem though. the problem is hosts refusing to estus phantoms unless they themselves are wounded. look i know that estus is precious and all. but if you're just going to stand there and watch me solo the four kings for you, just throw me a couple estus when im on half with two of their homing attacks coming towards me!

seriously, i'm trying to get into the spirit of sunbroing and help people fight bosses. I've quickly realized its all just carrying them through levels and then soloing a boss for them. and if i want a heal, i have to go against everything i know and let the host get beat up before i get a heal. Makes me think that my time is better spent tearing them apart as a darkwraith for a free humanity.

^ I literally just ran into a host like that. He summoned me in the township and was invaded almost immediately after I spawned. So I took out the invader by myself as he ran away. So I met him at the elevator, and he got invaded again. I chased the invader back towards the beginning of the area and took him out, again as the host ran away, and as I was bowing to the dying invader we got another, who took it upon himself to BS me before my bow animation had finished. So I was backing off waiting for the host to heal me, and the invader broke off and went for the host, and I decided just to let him. That's kinda what he gets for not helping me out.

I prefer my host to stay back. I prefer they heal me, but against invaders them fighting risks them dying and then we both fail. I'm their protector. They should help at range if its possible, and leave the dangerous crap to me.

Sometimes I help someone f.e. in the Undead Burg, taking on the Black Knight and the area where the Armored Hog is all by myself. I sometimes don't pay a lot of attention and I barely survive with about, let's say, 30hp left. And the host just stands there for a bit and walks on. I tend to block his next entrance off and message him to heal me with estus. He still didn't do it. I just waited untill he got invaded and BSC my way out of there

Forum Pirate wrote:I prefer my host to stay back. I prefer they heal me, but against invaders them fighting risks them dying and then we both fail. I'm their protector. They should help at range if its possible, and leave the dangerous crap to me.

Well I didn't mind him not fighting, but he just straight up ran away from everything, then when I was fighting that last invader, he was right there and watched me take a BS while I was gesturing to the fallen invader and didn't do anything to help. That's pretty weak no matter how you slice it. IMO when somebody BS's a bow all bets are off.

The BSC thing is pretty shady. But the be fair there are probably a ton of players that still have no idea you can heal your phantoms with estus. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe it's ever mentioned that you can.

I kind of think that's the kind of thing that falls under the "accessibility" that everyone freaks out about. If Solaire gave you the White Soapstone and was like "OH BY THE WAY, you can heal your friends with estus when they're in your world" it would have absolutely no impact on the game other than a few less ignorant hosts.

^ I find it pretty unlikely that someone would know how to use the BSC and not be aware that the estus heals your phantoms. I'm constantly running into players that have no idea they even have the BSC, but I feel like the estus thing is one of the first things we all figured out by accident

Yeah but I'm referring to two different types of players. If someone lets you kill the boss and then uses BSC at the last second they're probably well aware of the estus healing as well, they're just acting like a complete douche.

If someone doesn't heal you with estus, it's not necessarily because they're a douche, it may be because they're ignorant to the mechanic. And these are probably the same people that don't know what the BSC does. It's unlikely that the same people not healing out of ignorance are the same ones using BSC on you.

Of course you don't know if someone isn't healing you because they're ignorant or because they're a jerk. I'm just saying, both are plausible.

Yeah, I'll give you that. There could be a perfectly reasonable explanation for not being healed. However, I'm yet to hear one for the whole BSC thing. I don't see how it could possibly benefit the host in any way. It's purely just a **** move

In the unpatched game if you had a phantom with you it would split the souls I have been told.

I've heard talk of being able to revert to the unpatched version. I wonder if people who've done that can still have online interactions with people who are playing the patched versions? That could possibly explain it. Although it'd still be a richard move

The idea of reverting back to older patches is possible. But i'm almost positive you can't get online again with that specific account or any character you modify on a prior patch,

Also, i've had encounters that are worse in some ways. I've had people leave a white sign down, then when i look at them. See them decked out in gear thinking "yeah this person will be helpful" i try to summon, get halfway through the flickering summoning message. Then it fails. Seconds later THE SAME PERSON name and looks and all, invades me.

Not sure how they do this, but it's happened to me enough times to notice it.

sjackson12 wrote:Black Separation Covenant - allows you to invade people who separate their summons right before beating the boss.

Because seriously, *** those people.

I should clarify, they use them in a boss fight but right before the final blow they separate. I think it gives them more souls.

Are you sure you didn't lose connection? Doing this is illogical. You get the same amount of souls, humanity, bones, medals, ect. if you have phantoms or are by yourself. You would also probably open yourself to attack if you did this. I think your internet lost connection for a sec, and it happened to be near the end of the fight.

passivefamiliar wrote:The idea of reverting back to older patches is possible. But i'm almost positive you can't get online again with that specific account or any character you modify on a prior patch.

Once my friend accidentally patched his game, and then complained about no BB glitch. I uninstalled my patches to see if it could help him. When I started my game it said I couldn't go online untill I installed the patch. Then it said my saves were incompatible with my game. (The game was 1.00, but the saves were 1.05 or 1.06.)

passivefamiliar wrote:Also, i've had encounters that are worse in some ways. I've had people leave a white sign down, then when i look at them. See them decked out in gear thinking "yeah this person will be helpful" i try to summon, get halfway through the flickering summoning message. Then it fails. Seconds later THE SAME PERSON name and looks and all, invades me.

Not sure how they do this, but it's happened to me enough times to notice it.

I've had that happen to me once or twice. I think it's that "multiplayer colorblind glitch" (whites appear as reds, ect.) It happened on the PS3.

forum pirate wrote:I prefer my host to stay back. I prefer they heal me, but against invaders them fighting risks them dying and then we both fail. I'm their protector. They should help at range if its possible, and leave the dangerous crap to me.

Once I had a sunbro who did nothing but abandon me. Then I ranted about it by saying what you said. Everyone said I was wrong. I wish more people thought like you. Apparently the majority thinks phantoms are just there to look pretty.

WaffleGuy wrote:Sometimes I help someone f.e. in the Undead Burg, taking on the Black Knight and the area where the Armored Hog is all by myself. I sometimes don't pay a lot of attention and I barely survive with about, let's say, 30hp left. And the host just stands there for a bit and walks on. I tend to block his next entrance off and message him to heal me with estus. He still didn't do it. I just waited untill he got invaded and BSC my way out of there

Situations like that, I'm glad I have Great Heal. :o

RenegadeCop wrote:

WaffleGuy wrote:Sometimes I help someone f.e. in the Undead Burg, taking on the Black Knight and the area where the Armored Hog is all by myself. I sometimes don't pay a lot of attention and I barely survive with about, let's say, 30hp left. And the host just stands there for a bit and walks on. I tend to block his next entrance off and message him to heal me with estus. He still didn't do it. I just waited untill he got invaded and BSC my way out of there

Situations like that, I'm glad I have Great Heal. :o

I always have either heal or a few humanities, because I don't think it's the host's job to heal me, but I think it is their job to heal me in a boss fight.

WandererReece wrote:

sjackson12 wrote:Black Separation Covenant - allows you to invade people who separate their summons right before beating the boss.

Because seriously, *** those people.

I should clarify, they use them in a boss fight but right before the final blow they separate. I think it gives them more souls.

Are you sure you didn't lose connection? Doing this is illogical. You get the same amount of souls, humanity, bones, medals, ect. if you have phantoms or are by yourself. You would also probably open yourself to attack if you did this. I think your internet lost connection for a sec, and it happened to be near the end of the fight.

Yes I'm sure I didn't, because I heard the sound effect that using the BSC makes, and I didn't get disconnected from PSN.

Phantoms, to most people are'nt there to look pretty. They're there to hide behind and use as distractions for the host, in pretty much every fight I've ever been in.

sjackson12 wrote:Black Separation Covenant - allows you to invade people who separate their summons right before beating the boss.

Because seriously, *** those people.

Happened to me a couple of times before.

I paid a few of the hosts a visit as an invader shortly afterwards.

That's funny! I gotta try that

To me, coop is precisely that, a partnership. To be fair most levels i go through if they're readily available i usually just summon one guy and pretty much have a race to the finish with him, whilst clearing out all the enemies, fun stuff..

I think that using phantoms as your personal snowplow is pretty ****, though i admit i don't exactly bc out, and i always farm and pack some humanity so i know i can heal myself, i pretty muuch never expect my host to heal me, even though in an ideal world they should.

TO GET THIS THREAD BACK ON TOPIC......

There needs to be a covenant linked to sorcery. The dragon clan were screaming to have white dragon breath as a loyalty spell like lightning spear.. but oh well from missed a trick.

A covenant that actually targets hosts with phantoms in attempt to get into a 3v1, i know thats basically the Forestbros situation but i mean legitimately make it a covenant to anti-gank, though could mean FROM getting of their lovely fence thats more neutral than switzerland.