by Tolvo wrote:I'm pretty sure Dibs is just trolling us Serious.
It crossed my mind
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Serious_Much- Moderator Trainee
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It crossed my mind
Encore- Chosen Undead
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Let´s discuss the problem of evil... It´s funnier.
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If I was trolling you, I wouldn't put this much effort into it.Serious_Much wrote:Tolvo wrote:I'm pretty sure Dibs is just trolling us Serious.
It crossed my mind
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Monotheistic people typically think in the concept of God, not the concept of gods in other forms Dibs. Thus when discussing things with them, you generally consider things from the point of view of God being a single entity.
This is why you shouldn't try to discuss philosophy and/or religion when you know nothing about the subjects Dibs.
This is why you shouldn't try to discuss philosophy and/or religion when you know nothing about the subjects Dibs.
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Then ask something.Tehdoomgrasp wrote:Let´s discuss the problem of evil... It´s funnier.
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The problem of evil: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Problem_of_evil
God exists.
God is omnipotent, omniscient, and perfectly good.
A perfectly good being would want to prevent all evils.
An omniscient being knows every way in which evils can come into existence.
An omnipotent being, who knows every way in which an evil can come into existence, has the power to prevent that evil from coming into existence.
A being who knows every way in which an evil can come into existence, who is able to prevent that evil from coming into existence, and who wants to do so, would prevent the existence of that evil.
If there exists an omnipotent, omniscient, and perfectly good being, then no evil exists.
Evil exists (logical contradiction
God exists.
God is omnipotent, omniscient, and perfectly good.
A perfectly good being would want to prevent all evils.
An omniscient being knows every way in which evils can come into existence.
An omnipotent being, who knows every way in which an evil can come into existence, has the power to prevent that evil from coming into existence.
A being who knows every way in which an evil can come into existence, who is able to prevent that evil from coming into existence, and who wants to do so, would prevent the existence of that evil.
If there exists an omnipotent, omniscient, and perfectly good being, then no evil exists.
Evil exists (logical contradiction
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The subject was whether God, being an omnipotent and omniscient being, could create a boulder he could not lift.Tolvo wrote:Monotheistic people typically think in the concept of God, not the concept of gods in other forms Dibs. Thus when discussing things with them, you generally consider things from the point of view of God being a single entity.
This is why you shouldn't try to discuss philosophy and/or religion when you know nothing about the subjects Dibs.
It then turned to whether a boulder could hold the title of omnipotence.
Nowhere in there did I in any way make a statement that could be effected by someone who was of a different religion, as long as they have two things:
A monotheistic God
An all-powerful God
Those are the only two things required to satiate my arguments for being valid. If people are of a polytheistic religion or do not believe in an all-powerful God, then they could tell me and I could explain it differently.
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Tolvo- to put this in perspective this question was posed about the traditional christian view of god as:
Omnipotent, Omniscient, Benevolent, Omnipresent and eternal
thats the god we have to talk about for the question to work really
Teh- that question's actually more boring as there's 2 specific approaches to explain the problem of evil: Iranaen and augustinian theodicies
Omnipotent, Omniscient, Benevolent, Omnipresent and eternal
thats the god we have to talk about for the question to work really
Teh- that question's actually more boring as there's 2 specific approaches to explain the problem of evil: Iranaen and augustinian theodicies
Last edited by Serious_Much on Fri May 31, 2013 7:49 pm; edited 2 times in total
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I think any religion who's God has those qualities could fit into this discussion.Serious_Much wrote:Tolvo- to put this in perspective this question was posed about the traditional christian view of god as:
Omnipotent, Omniscient, Benevolent, Omnipresent and eternal
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Serious_Much- Moderator Trainee
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Dibsville wrote:I think any religion who's God has those qualities could fit into this discussion.Serious_Much wrote:Tolvo- to put this in perspective this question was posed about the traditional christian view of god as:
Omnipotent, Omniscient, Benevolent, Omnipresent and eternal
dibs my point was that the god had to have those qualities
obviously any god with those qualities could fit, but only the christian/jewish god does
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Either way, the discussion was not affected by religion. If you guys had different religious beliefs, then I seriously doubt you would have held on to your arguments for this long without stating it.
The thought that religion even mattered for this conversation is void.
The thought that religion even mattered for this conversation is void.
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now you're just being argumentative for the sake of it... lol
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Isn't that the point of the thread?
And no, I was making a serious remark to your statement.
And no, I was making a serious remark to your statement.
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In a lot of places that are English speaking, Christianity is the norm. Meaning they did not feel obligated to state their beliefs, as well people may not wish for others to know their religions unless they are asked. They may have felt it would seem pushy to bring up their own religions Dibs.
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I think it is time to leave the thread, it's not really a discussion as much as trying to explain things.
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But it was fun!
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Even if someone of a different religion posted in this therad, the question was straight forward to fit any religion.
"An all-powerful being creating a boulder he can not lift. Yes or no?"
Any religion could talk about what could happen. The fact that religion was even brought up was void to the argument.
"An all-powerful being creating a boulder he can not lift. Yes or no?"
Any religion could talk about what could happen. The fact that religion was even brought up was void to the argument.
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It was fun when we were actually having a philosophical discussion, it's deteriorated from that now though
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I'm just defending my point, you guys kept bringing up stuff void to my point of view.
A rock can't be omnipotent? Why the hell not? Because it can't move? That has nothing to do with its power. It can't be omnipotent because it's not a living being? Again, that has nothing to do with its power, only the way it acts.
A rock can't be omnipotent? Why the hell not? Because it can't move? That has nothing to do with its power. It can't be omnipotent because it's not a living being? Again, that has nothing to do with its power, only the way it acts.
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The question was never about the abilities of the rock, it was about the abilities of God.
Besides, god wasn't creating an omnipotent rock, as said in the question, it's just a rock he can't lift
Besides, god wasn't creating an omnipotent rock, as said in the question, it's just a rock he can't lift
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But the rock would have to be more powerful than God in order to not be lifted by him. At least that's what the discussion came to. But then I said that a boulder would be omnipotent if it was stronger than the strongest being, which is the definition of omnipotent. The conversation went awry from the start.
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Being stronger than omnipotent doesn't make one omnipotent. If it can't move itself that is a power it doesn't have, it does void the previous being's status as omnipotent since it has become more powerful in one way.
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All I can say is your logic is flawed. There's no reasoning with you.
