Dragon head stone: How much poise damge does it do?

I have been thinking of making (another) Dragonoid build 
 for PvP. Having ransacked my memories of the previous build I remembered that there were occasions where I managed to use the breath attack from the Dragon head stone to knock peoples shields away, although it didn't happen often as they usually get out of the way.

My question to all Dragon bros is if anyone actually knows how much poise damage the flames do and if it can actually stunlock some dude that's to slow to get out of the way?

And incidentally: is it actually possible to knock someone down with the Dragon stone Torso roar or can you only make them stagger?

 Been away from here for too long, btw. Nice to be back.^^

stunlock? only on really low poise builds, but if you combine the breath with a ultra great sword you can make an opponent with 77 poise stagger on the first weapon swing after getting in only one or two breath hits which cost very little stamina.

It does do a lot, but not a lot of damage, and its easy to dodge, it also does a lot of shield breaking. However, it won't do it instantly, you have to hold it, and even if they don't block or dodge, it leaves you very venerable when you do it, as you move slowly and it will consume a lot of stamina.
 
It can be very effective though, whenever someone cheats against me on PC, I turn on unlimited stamina and it is nearly impossible to get out of it, but for normal things, it doesn't do enough damage to warrant using all your stamina, usually wastefully. Roar stuns much better.

It's hard to imagine a 0 or 40 poise dragon head poise trading with most weapons, especially because it gets out-damaged too so it completely loses trades.  I don't dragonbro at all but I've fought quite a few, and I can't say I've ever even seen it used as a direct poise-break attack.

sparkly-twinkly-lizard wrote:stunlock? only on really low poise builds, but if you combine the breath with a ultra great sword you can make an opponent with 77 poise stagger on the first weapon swing after getting in only one or two breath hits which cost very little stamina.

 Not a bad idea. I'll try that out. My Dragonoid is a STR build after all.

ICEFANG wrote:It does do a lot, but not a lot of damage, and its easy to dodge, it also does a lot of shield breaking. However, it won't do it instantly, you have to hold it, and even if they don't block or dodge, it leaves you very venerable when you do it, as you move slowly and it will consume a lot of stamina.

Then do you think it would be viable to use a third or half a bar of stamina to break through someone's guard and then use the remaining stamina to launch a rush attack?

TheMeInTeam wrote:It's hard to imagine a 0 or 40 poise dragon head poise trading with most weapons, especially because it gets out-damaged too so it completely loses trades.  I don't dragonbro at all but I've fought quite a few, and I can't say I've ever even seen it used as a direct poise-break attack.

I discovered early on that the Havel shield buff makes my dragon's poise, um, Everlasting! ....For 40 seconds.
I have been killed with the buff on, but never ever been staggered.

The havel buff is a different scenario haha.  I wouldn't poise race anybody with that on.  Dragon roar + havel buff = back away from that asap...maybe a 2h buffed curve sword or kat with high poise of its own could keep up...dunno.

Is it actually easier to land than fire surge?  I've never used it myself but if it is like that the head stone is junk compared to the torso stone IMO.  You can pull all kinds of nonsense with the torso stone; it's basically a force spell that doubles as a damage multiplier, so tick stabs off of it are really nasty.

Well flame surge is very different in that you can keep it up indefinitely without draining stamina, but it has a limit on charges and the flames travel slower and less far (as far as I remember). Fire surge also has an advantage in startup and ending lag.

Maybe I should test this on my build to see which "spell" does more damage.

The DTS have several uses though, one among them is to harass players who are out of melee range and have trouble reaching you. The forest with the hunters is a great place to use this because it's very easy to get stuck between the trees or on opposite sides of the hill near Alvina. This won't kill them, but it will stress them out enough that they make mistakes.

TheBlackWaltz wrote:

sparkly-twinkly-lizard wrote:stunlock? only on really low poise builds, but if you combine the breath with a ultra great sword you can make an opponent with 77 poise stagger on the first weapon swing after getting in only one or two breath hits which cost very little stamina.

 Not a bad idea. I'll try that out. My Dragonoid is a STR build after all.

ICEFANG wrote:It does do a lot, but not a lot of damage, and its easy to dodge, it also does a lot of shield breaking. However, it won't do it instantly, you have to hold it, and even if they don't block or dodge, it leaves you very venerable when you do it, as you move slowly and it will consume a lot of stamina.

Then do you think it would be viable to use a third or half a bar of stamina to break through someone's guard and then use the remaining stamina to launch a rush attack?

TheMeInTeam wrote:It's hard to imagine a 0 or 40 poise dragon head poise trading with most weapons, especially because it gets out-damaged too so it completely loses trades.  I don't dragonbro at all but I've fought quite a few, and I can't say I've ever even seen it used as a direct poise-break attack.

I discovered early on that the Havel shield buff makes my dragon's poise, um, Everlasting! ....For 40 seconds.
I have been killed with the buff on, but never ever been staggered.

 Man I haven't quoted yet with this new format. Very interesting.

Half of your stamina is a roar, better to just use that in every way. Really, I found breath to be good as a bow would be (when they will miss, you hit for a little damage), using it for too long to try and hit is less effective. Also much more effective on players with low END, low fire res shields, and low poise, all of which are uncommon though.