whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

Rumeye wrote:The lowest thing you can do in this game is resorting to TWOP, its not as overpowered as it used to be but still casting it the most cowardly act you could commit. I can only slightly tolerate it if its being used against a gank squad and if your strategy absolutely depends on it.

I like using it on my slow walker poise stacked tank. Brings them to my speed lol. I always though TWOP should just make your enemy move at the same speed you moved. Would be fair then.

crbngville2 wrote:I am really at the point of not caring/judging how someone else plays THEIR game. Who are we to tell anyone what to do or how to play THEIR game. From included rules with the copy of software they sold you. If what someone wants to do in THEIR game doesn't violate those rules, who are we to tell them differently? Everyone has a different view of what's considered cheap, and chances are that noone is correct.

The OP posted this : "what else am I supposed to do?"
No body is enforcing anything here, he asked for opinions and help and he got both, he can do what ever he wants of course but since he asked...well!

Rynn actually had a good point about TwoP, if you couldn't attack with it active. So it would be useful for escapes, someone is cornering you, cast TwoP and as they can't run, run past them and to a place you'd rather fight them or towards the fog door. I actually kind of like that idea.

Glute, cheap and cheating are of course very different, but cheap is not a universal definition and even when there's a strong consensus (which there is here admittedly) cheap does not mean "not enjoyable for anyone"

If the OP does this technique to fight others here is the end result:

He wins some fights
Some people call him cheap
He loses some fights


Hopefully he enjoys his game too.


I do wanna say though that it's awesome that many posters here have given him alternative strategies to make sorcery effective. While, as I've stated, am zero opposed to him using this tactic; I also support people learning and growing and he's been getting a lot of support.

I'd actually say cheap is definable, the issue is whether something being cheap is a bad thing.

Tolvo wrote:....I'd actually say cheap is definable....

Cheap.

A word commonly used to imitate the sound of a baby chicken. Also considered synonomous in cartoons with "cherp" "chip" and sometimes "****-a-doodle-doo". Looney Toons is commonly considered to be the founder and creator of the term we all know and love today.

Glutebrah wrote:
I like using it on my slow walker poise stacked tank. Brings them to my speed lol. I always though TWOP should just make your enemy move at the same speed you moved. Would be fair then.

It would be useless if understanded you correctly, how is it benefiting you if it makes the opponent move at the same speed you’re moving, you’ll have no clear advantage that way even if you’re slow walking.

Actually if you are a fat rolling person against someone fast rolling in little gear, you have a poise and defense advantage while making them move at your level of mobility.

I would say nope, nothing wrong with using twop to land spells...
But I would also say there's nothing right with it either...
Confusing yes?

Tolvo wrote:Actually if you are a fat rolling person against someone fast rolling in little gear, you have a poise and defense advantage while making them move at your level of mobility.

This. It would be a spell primarily designed for Fat rolling Tanks, it would still be OP when mixed with Magic and spell spams, but at the same time both people are Fat rolling so Magic can be used both ways

Tolvo wrote:Actually if you are a fat rolling person against someone fast rolling in little gear, you have a poise and defense advantage while making them move at your level of mobility.

True, but it won’t be very effective unless you cast it just before you jump spawning invaders, the only way i get caught in it is if I’m being spawn ganked, it would only be viable to slow walking/fat rolling mages or spawn jumpers which doesn’t make it any better. The whole concept of a spell that paralyzes your opponent making them almost completely helpless is just bad no matter how you look at it. And in my opinion, Iron Flesh is the better spell for slow walking tanks, cnsidering that the hypothetical TWOP has also a time limit of 10 seconds.

evandmcgrath95 wrote:To me its frustrating to have invested so much into sorcery and just miss again and again. Its so rare to actually land that soul spear and usually its just luck, like he was in the middle of eating moss/grass.
I guess it is strong but what else am I supposed to do?

nothing is wrong with it…it's just really annoying when you are the victim, yet still funny as hell when you are the perpetrator.

Nybbles wrote:

evandmcgrath95 wrote:To me its frustrating to have invested so much into sorcery and just miss again and again. Its so rare to actually land that soul spear and usually its just luck, like he was in the middle of eating moss/grass.
I guess it is strong but what else am I supposed to do?

nothing is wrong with it…it's just really annoying when you are the victim, yet still funny as hell when you are the perpetrator.

Until someone rolls out of your range and CSS you while you're casting TWOP, or you get backstabbed or double black flamed lol.

It takes away the ability to roll away from castings which is a common tactic used by people when they dont have SMS, GMB, or when the Crest Shield is simply not enough.

Rolling to evade attacks is a key element in Dark Souls combat. Its not unbeatable, but it can be very problematic in various circumstances. It some cases its complete overkill.

It's an in game mechanic and essentially an intended method of combat. Casting a spell and taking advantage of its effects is really just a logical move. I've used TWoP a couple times to great scythe some fool. Boy was he shocked.

Using TWoP and then following through is just as much a part of the game as hitting R1 and letting your weapon swing.

Fun fact: certain martial arts advocate the grabbing and twisting of male genitalia during a fight. A move considered "cheap," "unsportsmanlike" and downright rude by many.

But remember, history is written by the victor. A philosophy that a major segment of the world adheres to.

Animaaal wrote:It takes away the ability to roll away from castings which is a common tactic used by people when they dont have SMS, GMB, or when the Crest Shield is simply not enough.

Rolling to evade attacks is a key element in Dark Souls combat. Its not unbeatable, but it can be very problematic in various circumstances. It some cases its complete overkill.

If they dead-angle you, then what's left? You can't dodge, can't block, can't parry. GMB works, but only if it's actually magic damage, so it doesn't protect from pyromancies and lightning spears. Your only real defence against TWoP is not getting caught in it to begin with.

Maneater_Mildred wrote:I would say nope, nothing wrong with using twop to land spells...
But I would also say there's nothing right with it either...
Confusing yes?

This is basically my position with using TWOP to land spells.

I'd still recommend understanding how to land spells without it though like what everyone mentioned before.

I guess I'll clarify. TWoD + WoG dead angle or Pursuers or CSS or DB is one of the few things in this game that are cheap. BUT, if I'm invading a quester, they can do what ever they want to stay alive. If, I'm invading a ganker (or camper), then that is different. If I'm in a FC and I know TWoD is allowed, then that is my own fault and I have no right to complain.

I block people all the time (and unblock people too). I just do it if I don't want to fight them, for whatever reason. Even for something as simple as I keep invading their world. It sure beats getting upset or wanting to send hatemail.

I wish we could block on Xbox. And what does TWoD mean? I only know TWoP :c

Personally, I don't mind TWoP to land sorceries, I do however, mind people who use TWoP right next to me while I'm spawning.

Animaaal wrote:It takes away the ability to roll away from castings which is a common tactic used by people when they dont have SMS, GMB, or when the Crest Shield is simply not enough.

Rolling to evade attacks is a key element in Dark Souls combat. Its not unbeatable, but it can be very problematic in various circumstances. It some cases its complete overkill.

I guess I should clarify too. This was directed at the OP, and why someone, imo, would call him cheap for doing it.

@toast

Theres a glitch that allows you to "buff" TWoP causing it to inflict damage...its brutal.

That's pure evil.

I still laugh each time I see your sig by the way.

Anyways, it's easy to avoid TWoP if you're not spawning, if they get caught in it when it's evident you're casting it, then really they deserve the CSS to the face.

Latitoast wrote:That's pure evil.

I still laugh each time I see your sig by the way.

Anyways, it's easy to avoid TWoP if you're not spawning, if they get caught in it when it's evident you're casting it, then really they deserve the CSS to the face.

Ya its devil play for sure.

Thanks. Wuv my sig, and my avvy. The guy in front looks so serious lol.

And ya TWoP is easy to avoid and counter, but combine it with a few other techniques and its ridiculous at times...kinda like Pursuers....or women and shoes...or men and women...or....

It's as ridiculous as Kermit looking at two frogs.

i just realized Vow of Silence is probably the best counter to TWOP, that way they can't cast anything including Pyro, then just put your back to the wall to stop Back stabs.

^Wow, thats a great argument. You could buff and then cast VoS right? Because VoS is 30 faith I think, and then you could get the most out of it???

Also, would VoS work on a TWoP user if they already done casted it?