Why are everyone over leveled as f*ck?

I think a lot of it has to due with players taking their high lvl toons to Oolacile in the hopes of actually finding pvp at their level in the arena. Then after siting for hours only to get 3 or 4 lagged matches against the same players using cheap tactics they're forced to go back to hosting with now crushed spirits.
-My experience in Oolacile

I pretty much predicted this would occur once the DLC came into effect. Many people do not want to give up the benefits of using the nerf items so have decided to level up to still have that option available to them. I have seen a tremendous amount of new players up at the 700 level since the DLC came out. The 120 cap is on its way to becoming obsolete except to those who still prefer to hold onto it. But as I had stated in previous posts this will put them at a huge disadvantage when invading or being invaded by certain covenants. Just my opin.

I was originally going to cap at 120 but i've been convinced to up to SL200. I don't PvP much but it still viable. I get invaded more often then when i was SL120 and below.

vatar5 wrote:

Juutas wrote:

vatar5 wrote:I don't see the problem with over-leveled people.
They usually know that they won't see much coop but it gives challenge to invaders.

I care when it's a guy with million stacks or combustion, wog and pursuers and flips around with impossible poise and bsing with hornet. Not fun build to fight, challenging maybe, but not fun.

Then level up.

Or that means you can complain if you fight someone SL 100 in the arena when you're SL 80...

It's not like you can force everyone to play at the soul levels you want them to be so...

I didn't say everyone should be on same level, but I think it's just boring that people are too scared to challenge themselves to actually make BUILDS and still want to flip around in superior armor and poise and cast every spell possible. I hoped the new patch would eliminate this goofyness and I would see more interesting builds, but I guess I was wrong.

EDIT: Post number 666 HAIL SATAN!

Maybe they were going for higher NG playthroughs ?

Theres more to Dark Souls than just PVP and not everyone goes to the Forum or the Wiki to read up on the "Rules" or "Caps" for it .
They just enjoy PVP but dont know about the "Rules" .

Marino. wrote:Maybe they were going for higher NG playthroughs ?

Theres more to Dark Souls than just PVP and not everyone goes to the Forum or the Wiki to read up on the "Rules" or "Caps" for it .
They just enjoy PVP but dont know about the "Rules" .

Unfortunately this is not the case. same super high level players just waiting there and hosting (usually with million stacks of spells so they have cleared the game multiple times already), or super high lvl dark moons invading.
One other interesting thing is that I get waaaay more dark moons invading me than I get dark wraiths now a days that wasn't really that common for me pre patch.
It's also stupid when I get invaded by a dark wraith under lvl 50 or something, because on lvl that low you can't compete no matter what your skills are (okay maybe if you go for pyro). If we cannot have a common level to go to anymore, the next souls game has to fix the invasions a bit.
Good old days 90% of the people I invaded were lvl 120

As PC player my question is : Why is everyone Underlvld?

On topic tho, Oolacile is probably new forest on consoles or gankers galore

You missed my Point Juutas .

People just like to PVP while not realizing that they are "Overleveled" or use "Cheap" tactics .

Just keep doing your thing man . You will come across enough People with the same mindset as you

Nothing wrong with leveling up to make the build you want. It sounds like there is PvP at many levels, which is good. 120ish is a "cap" many of us use for duelling, not for invading.

everyone go to stoicism and fight as 120 in 100-200 bracket?

I mean 80 soul level diff is a lot but if you know many other players are going to 120 as well it'd be safe to say it was a fair fight right?

no?

I dunno

it's night time and I'm feelin a little bold

There should be no complaint on invading higher levels. Being at higher level puts everyone on a more even playing field when comes to fighting in your range, and adds variety. I have a toon that is at 200at the moment and plan to just keep going until I can use all weapons effectively. At any time I can switch out everything and be a completely different toon. At 120 and lower I had the worst experiences ever. Everyone was the same build, took advantage of every little glitch and was hardly ever prepared for multiple opponents. Now, I enjoy playing dark souls online. In my opinion lower builds ruin the game because when you get a lower build invasion and you beat them, A. It's no fun. B. they will complain even though all they did was spam BS and some other cheap tactic. And C. Complain that others are leveling up.

Juutas wrote:I have been invading on lvl 100 constantly at the Township for a week now and about 8/10 players are super high level....I mean what is up with that? I didn't have this problem when 120 was still a thing, but now it seems everyone is considerably higher level (at least 150-300 sometimes even higher) I don't mind if I have to fight guys higher than me SOMETIMES, but all the time...are people really too scared to play at lower levels now a days?
Has arena brought this nasty side effect? do you have same kind of experiences when invading?

You're invading at the closest bonfire to the arena which is set up with brackets of 200 and above. There is your answer.

If you want to fight exclusively in the arena then stay at 100. I leveled my invade/host darkwraith character to 230ish to keep up with all the high level darkmoons invading me.

The only reasons I'm staying at level 100 are for the possibility of returning to the arena and tournaments. I'm glad that organized PvP at least hovers around 100 still.

I do some PvP from sl 6 to sl 458, so I'm not sure how that fits into your fear theory, juutas.

I prefer high-level PvP though, mostly because I really despise elementals. I'm not sure what it is about them I hate so much. Elementals just seem... cheap, somehow; I don't know (and no offense meant toward those of you who like them), but if I never see another lightning katana again it'll be too soon. Thankfully they're rare at higher sl's.

Knight Alundil wrote:

Juutas wrote:I have been invading on lvl 100 constantly at the Township for a week now and about 8/10 players are super high level....I mean what is up with that? I didn't have this problem when 120 was still a thing, but now it seems everyone is considerably higher level (at least 150-300 sometimes even higher) I don't mind if I have to fight guys higher than me SOMETIMES, but all the time...are people really too scared to play at lower levels now a days?
Has arena brought this nasty side effect? do you have same kind of experiences when invading?

You're invading at the closest bonfire to the arena which is set up with brackets of 200 and above. There is your answer.

Yeah this might be right...I guess I have to move back to burg, but invasions there are not too frequent anymore.

@callipygias: I don't think the elementals are problem anymore because well....they really suck after the patch, I would never even think to fight with elemental over +15.

@stone inc: you ever wonder why overleveled guys never complain? because most of the guys are below their level thus having upper hand.

The most annoying thing about over leveling the character is that it's not a build anymore, there is no weakness, it's still the same heavyarmor/poise flipper than pre patch so nothing changed. On lvl 100-120 the build stays reasonable and it can display weakness and strenght, or am I really the only one who supports that everything should not always be min/maxed?

SL 60 (with maxed gear). Enough to have 40 vit and 30 end. That is where skill takes over, higher sl builds may be more versatile (so they have an advantage), but it is no substitute for skill. Unless the matched players have similar skill levels, the versatility won't decide the fight, the skill gap will.

I've lost to sl 8's (well, jus the one using the hring and a lightning handaxe, he roll bs'd me to death)and beaten sl 150's with the same sl 80 character. Billy has beaten sl 200+ characters with a sl 55.

The invasion system works like it does, to allow a big sl difference because, like life, dark souls isn't always fair. If everything was always fair, it would be boring. Invasions would lose a lot of their thrill if I never had to be worried about a phantom or 2 waiting to ambush me.

Be glad that, unlike life, There is always something you can do to win, despite the long odds.

If you really want close sl's, there is always the arena.

Juutas wrote:

Knight Alundil wrote:

Juutas wrote:I have been invading on lvl 100 constantly at the Township for a week now and about 8/10 players are super high level....I mean what is up with that? I didn't have this problem when 120 was still a thing, but now it seems everyone is considerably higher level (at least 150-300 sometimes even higher) I don't mind if I have to fight guys higher than me SOMETIMES, but all the time...are people really too scared to play at lower levels now a days?
Has arena brought this nasty side effect? do you have same kind of experiences when invading?

You're invading at the closest bonfire to the arena which is set up with brackets of 200 and above. There is your answer.

Yeah this might be right...I guess I have to move back to burg, but invasions there are not too frequent anymore.

@callipygias: I don't think the elementals are problem anymore because well....they really suck after the patch, I would never even think to fight with elemental over +15.

@stone inc: you ever wonder why overleveled guys never complain? because most of the guys are below their level thus having upper hand.

The most annoying thing about over leveling the character is that it's not a build anymore, there is no weakness, it's still the same heavyarmor/poise flipper than pre patch so nothing changed. On lvl 100-120 the build stays reasonable and it can display weakness and strenght, or am I really the only one who supports that everything should not always be min/maxed?

Nah, you're not the only one. SL 100 is my favorite level to duel at because of the very reasons you listed. I used to PvP at 120-125 but after trying out 100 I couldn't go back because anything over that felt like I was getting to many options in my builds. Having strengths and weaknesses really adds to PvP in my opinion, and you need to really bring out your skills when facing a build that emphasizes on your weakness.

The reason we don't like everyone going to such high levels is because they have the option to just change weapons or equipment on the fly when facing their weakness. To each his own, though. When I'm invading I know they're most likely going to be a higher level than me anyway.

And @Forum Pirate, I wouldn't be surprised if Juutas was bored of the arena. He's ranked really high and the fights are getting monotonous there now.

The Letter X wrote:

Juutas wrote:

Knight Alundil wrote:

Juutas wrote:I have been invading on lvl 100 constantly at the Township for a week now and about 8/10 players are super high level....I mean what is up with that? I didn't have this problem when 120 was still a thing, but now it seems everyone is considerably higher level (at least 150-300 sometimes even higher) I don't mind if I have to fight guys higher than me SOMETIMES, but all the time...are people really too scared to play at lower levels now a days?
Has arena brought this nasty side effect? do you have same kind of experiences when invading?

You're invading at the closest bonfire to the arena which is set up with brackets of 200 and above. There is your answer.

Yeah this might be right...I guess I have to move back to burg, but invasions there are not too frequent anymore.

@callipygias: I don't think the elementals are problem anymore because well....they really suck after the patch, I would never even think to fight with elemental over +15.

@stone inc: you ever wonder why overleveled guys never complain? because most of the guys are below their level thus having upper hand.

The most annoying thing about over leveling the character is that it's not a build anymore, there is no weakness, it's still the same heavyarmor/poise flipper than pre patch so nothing changed. On lvl 100-120 the build stays reasonable and it can display weakness and strenght, or am I really the only one who supports that everything should not always be min/maxed?

Nah, you're not the only one. SL 100 is my favorite level to duel at because of the very reasons you listed. I used to PvP at 120-125 but after trying out 100 I couldn't go back because anything over that felt like I was getting to many options in my builds. Having strengths and weaknesses really adds to PvP in my opinion, and you need to really bring out your skills when facing a build that emphasizes on your weakness.

The reason we don't like everyone going to such high levels is because they have the option to just change weapons or equipment on the fly when facing their weakness. To each his own, though. When I'm invading I know they're most likely going to be a higher level than me anyway.

And @Forum Pirate, I wouldn't be surprised if Juutas was bored of the arena. He's ranked really high and the fights are getting monotonous there now.

The arena has one very obvious problem = no one is there, I mean it's impossible to get a match at the duel section anymore. I don't know if I play at the wrong time of the day but it's completely abandoned.

To the topic of fighting high level guys: I win most of the time eventhough my opponent is super high leveled compared to mine, but when they win it's always just because of the fact that they have max hp and can wear whatever they want and still flip, usually they wouldn't stand a chance. I like challenge and I like SOMETIMES fighting guys higher leveled than myself, but not all the time and I really do not want to take my char to lvl 200 when there's no challenge at all because the "build" that is actually 10 different builds at the same time.
I can't even remember when was the last time high leveled guys have displayed too much "skill", it is their builds that win not the players and that is what wrong here.

Maybe this enters into wining zone soon, but this problem didn't exist pre patch and frankly I really do not like the current state of PvP. More Skill, less levels people.

Thats an excuse. Your losses are on you, not your build (because I know you can build properly.) Perhaps they were using a build at a lower sl, you would win, its also possible that if you leveled up to where they are they'd flatten you. Without doing both, you can't know.

I am genuinely better with stricter builds, an abundance of versatility distracts me from focusing on what I'm good at by providing to much to think about at once. Others are different and thrive on versatility, to make the best use of every potential weapon/skill. This roughly translates to me being better at or below 120, above that its just overwhelming and I lose to people who are used to having 4 or 5 weapons (not to mention spells) on them at once.

Besides, cracked eye orbs have sl restrictions in both directions yeah? Use those when the arena is slow.

Forum Pirate wrote:Thats an excuse. Your losses are on you, not your build (because I know you can build properly.) Perhaps they were using a build at a lower sl, you would win, its also possible that if you leveled up to where they are they'd flatten you. Without doing both, you can't know.

I am genuinely better with stricter builds, an abundance of versatility distracts me from focusing on what I'm good at by providing to much to think about at once. Others are different and thrive on versatility, to make the best use of every potential weapon/skill. This roughly translates to me being better at or below 120, above that its just overwhelming and I lose to people who are used to having 4 or 5 weapons (not to mention spells) on them at once.

Besides, cracked eye orbs have sl restrictions in both directions yeah? Use those when the arena is slow.

Cracked red eye orbs have that!!?? really!!?? I have to try that out, this is whole new info for me!
And no, it's not an excuse because when my opponent has better armor, better poise, better damage imput and better hp than me and by the end of the match when they win they have one hit left of health I know I would've won if he wouldn't be so overleveled. Skill does matter the most, BUT it doesn't remove the fact that their build is way better than mine, which makes them get lucky more easily.

poise above 82 (two katana hits) is irrelivant and 96 can be reached with 40 end while maintaining a mid roll, even when using a great club and the silver knights shield.

at sl 100+ this is done with over 400 physical defense and 350 ish elemental defenses. There is no significant improvement that can be made on that total defense.

it also nets +1800 hp (after which only huge vit stacking makes any difference, though it can be done, this is your one potential disadvantage stat wise)

the ar on the great club is 657, there are 3 (i think) weapons in total that can rival that damage unbuffed no matter the sl (so they're almost certainly doing less damage than you are). If you let them buff, its on you.

At 120, you have acess to slb as well, putting the damage far beyond most anything else.

Hp pool is the only potentially valid arguement that puts the build above player skill here, and its by no means a garuntee as it requires 49 points that could go into something else to boost versatility or spell damage. It could also bump equip weight for movement speed, but thats in no way a substitute for skill.

If the people you have a problem with are sl 250 spear flippers then I can't blame you for hating them, but they are frustrating at best at any sl.

I'm not saying I don't understand being frustrated with a constant stream of players 100+ sls above you, but if you're sl 100+ I am saying that the build you are using is comporable (possibly better) than theirs, despite the sl difference due to diminishing returns.



If you were serious about not knowing the cracked orbs have restrictions both ways, then I'm glad I could help.

Forum Pirate wrote:poise above 82 (two katana hits) is irrelivant and 96 can be reached with 40 end while maintaining a mid roll, even when using a great club and the silver knights shield.

at sl 100+ this is done with over 400 physical defense and 350 ish elemental defenses. There is no significant improvement that can be made on that total defense.

it also nets +1800 hp (after which only huge vit stacking makes any difference, though it can be done, this is your one potential disadvantage stat wise)

the ar on the great club is 657, there are 3 (i think) weapons in total that can rival that damage unbuffed no matter the sl (so they're almost certainly doing less damage than you are). If you let them buff, its on you.

At 120, you have acess to slb as well, putting the damage far beyond most anything else.

Hp pool is the only potentially valid arguement that puts the build above player skill here, and its by no means a garuntee as it requires 49 points that could go into something else to boost versatility or spell damage. It could also bump equip weight for movement speed, but thats in no way a substitute for skill.

If the people you have a problem with are sl 250 spear flippers then I can't blame you for hating them, but they are frustrating at best at any sl.

I'm not saying I don't understand being frustrated with a constant stream of players 100+ sls above you, but if you're sl 100+ I am saying that the build you are using is comporable (possibly better) than theirs, despite the sl difference due to diminishing returns.



If you were serious about not knowing the cracked orbs have restrictions both ways, then I'm glad I could help.

Yes I was totally serious about the cracked orbs and I'm very glad I do now so thank you very much for the new information (never too late to learn something more, haha!).
Yeah the HP is the most signifigant difference, but also they don't necessary need to equip FAP ring to have high hp and to wear heavy armor, so they can also use two ring slots to other purposes and I think that is pretty major diffence.

Its funny you should say that because its the same thing I have felt about people playing at 120. That they should actually challenge themselves more and level up instead of relying on build creating to simply stay at a particular level. I have played both and I am saying this from my experiance: I run into more noobs at 120 sl then I do at 700. About 90 percent more noobs at 120 while at 700 I face maybe 20 percent while the other 80 are actually very experianced players. Playing at 120 gave me a false sense of confidence because honestly I was mostly facing players that are new and should not be fighting me at all. I was basically griefing without intending too. At 700 sl I dont have that worry at all up here its simply about survival. About 97 percent of the players up here at highly skilled and creative japanese fighters. Of course I do play at night which accounts for this. But honestly I have never been more challenged as a player constantly then fighting up at the higher levels. Again this is my experiance from playing both 120 and 710. I dont know if you have a high level toon or not. I am guessing you do not becuase I would have seen you up here. Everyone has their own preference on how they approach this game as well as their own experiance. If you prefer to stay at 120 that is fine but you have to realize that others do not have that same preference. And that what you find challenging at 120 is not to other players. Again the new DLC in my opin has punished those that still prefer to fight exclusively at 120. You will be at a disadvantage now because many more people have chosen to play the way this game was created to be played. By leveling up. The die hards have their perference but honestly they should not discourage nor discount those that choose to play the way they want too. Just my opin.

lorenzo110 wrote:Its funny you should say that because its the same thing I have felt about people playing at 120. That they should actually challenge themselves more and level up instead of relying on build creating to simply stay at a particular level. I have played both and I am saying this from my experiance: I run into more noobs at 120 sl then I do at 700. About 90 percent more noobs at 120 while at 700 I face maybe 20 percent while the other 80 are actually very experianced players. Playing at 120 gave me a false sense of confidence because honestly I was mostly facing players that are new and should not be fighting me at all. I was basically griefing without intending too. At 700 sl I dont have that worry at all up here its simply about survival. About 97 percent of the players up here at highly skilled and creative japanese fighters. Of course I do play at night which accounts for this. But honestly I have never been more challenged as a player constantly then fighting up at the higher levels. Again this is my experiance from playing both 120 and 710. I dont know if you have a high level toon or not. I am guessing you do not becuase I would have seen you up here. Everyone has their own preference on how they approach this game as well as their own experiance. If you prefer to stay at 120 that is fine but you have to realize that others do not have that same preference. And that what you find challenging at 120 is not to other players. Again the new DLC in my opin has punished those that still prefer to fight exclusively at 120. You will be at a disadvantage now because many more people have chosen to play the way this game was created to be played. By leveling up. The die hards have their perference but honestly they should not discourage nor discount those that choose to play the way they want too. Just my opin.

Well I'm an xbox guy so you couldn't have seen me up there with the "skilled japanese players".
I haven't played maxed out toon, but I've fought and beaten several maxed players and all of them have been really bad players like most high level guys I've fought.
Do you realise that on lvl 710 you are griefing just about anyone and never even have to face someone higher than you? how does being lvl 120 make you fight more noobs, when with 710 you can get invaded by players on any level? Isn't there just more and more chance that you will greatly overpower them? (I understand this if you are just invading as a dark wraith and not hosting, but if you invade as darkmoon or host that point just doens't make any sense.)
Nobody can't deny the fact that higher level toon is always better stat-vise than low level so don't try to excuse super high level character either + that "about 97 percent" is kinda just shooting numbers out of your *** (I'm sorry if you really calculated this somehow, but that's how it sounds to me).
All honestly skilled players I've fought mostly rock 100-120 builds still this day, some even a little lower than that, but the real problem is: where have all good players wanished?
I guess I could make one maxed out toon and see how these players who "play the game as it should be played" do against me then, haha, but so far the high leveled players I've met don't have the skill to back up what you've said. Maybe the high level players on PS3 are better than on Xbox, who knows.