I Feel Ashamed

By the way, the standard gaming definition of ganking is using a higher level, or numbers to create a situation where your opposition is at an extreme disadvantage.

OP this thread is confusing to me. You're asking if you should feel bad but don't want to be told to feel bad. It you have no regrets then have no regrets and don't say you feel ashamed. It we choose to play the game the way we do why apologize for it? So surely you created this thread for an open discussion?

Ugh. "Tryhard" is right up there with "OP" for annoying terms. In invasions, there is no reason someone should have to handicap themselves in order to not be labelled a "tryhard" or "OP" (both of which are very subjective and ephemeral). Organized duels - completely different story.

There are no universal rules of engagement. So, no matter what you do, someone will complain about it. I mirror my playstyle after my opponent's. So, if you were being gank-stabbed, then returning the favor is perfectly fine. IMO, of course.

aprilmanha wrote:Well we can argue word definitions all day and not agree, so we can just agree to not argue about it.

If I meet tryhards in game who manage to repeat invade me, I just disconnect and reconnect to boot them out. That way I always win. And that way I don't need to resort to cheap tactics to win and risk them feeling like it is ok to do the same.

You sir are what i call a "bull ****" Ganking is a term used across games to describe Gang **** see the resemblance? Ganking is 2+versus 1 less than larger number

reim0027 wrote:Ugh. "Tryhard" is right up there with "OP" for annoying terms. In invasions, there is no reason someone should have to handicap themselves in order to not be labelled a "tryhard" or "OP" (both of which are very subjective and ephemeral). Organized duels - completely different story.

There are no universal rules of engagement. So, no matter what you do, someone will complain about it.

Thank you

Play however you want and if they don't like it, its not your problem.

I play however I feel like at the time, which almost never involves rules beyond "don't send hatemail" and "don't interfere in ongoing fights with invaders."

I pull no punches and expect, even hope for, the same.

I do think Tryhard and OP are words that can be used correctly, but are almost never done so.

If your little brother wants to have fun and play a video game with you when he is five, and you destroy him in it then brag you are trying way too hard. Though, a better term would being a bad sport.

Same for OP, in a game if there are three guns to choose from and one's advantage is it has range, the other speed, and the third power, range, speed, and it buffs your health, that gun is over powered.

tinypantha wrote:

aprilmanha wrote:Well we can argue word definitions all day and not agree, so we can just agree to not argue about it.

If I meet tryhards in game who manage to repeat invade me, I just disconnect and reconnect to boot them out. That way I always win. And that way I don't need to resort to cheap tactics to win and risk them feeling like it is ok to do the same.

You sir are what i call a "bull ****" Ganking is a term used across games to describe Gang **** see the resemblance? Ganking is 2+versus 1 less than larger number

And Invaders always out number a host, because they have the AI on their side as well.

Tolvo wrote:I do think Tryhard and OP are words that can be used correctly, but are almost never done so.

Well if it makes any difference I've been useing OP only to mean Original Poster this whole time!

aprilmanha: Professional gankers tend to kill the enemies in the level anyway. So no, the invader doesn't have an advantage. Not to mention how useless that advantage is most of the times.

The only time enemy AI ever helped me out without having to force it to was this time when I got Spawn ganked and as I died the thief in darkroot forest ran over and backstabbed the host to death.

Sloth9230 wrote:aprilmanha: Professional gankers tend to kill the enemies in the level anyway. So no, the invader doesn't have an advantage. Not to mention how useless that advantage is most of the times.

The only time enemy AI ever helped me out without having to force it to was this time when I got Spawn ganked and as I died the thief in darkroot forest ran over and backstabbed the host to death.

The other reason I say that Hosts cannot be gankers.... It's their game. The invader is in the wrong by being there and any method to remove them is permitted. This is of course different to duals, as previously mentioned by another post.

If I am trying to have some fun Coop with a friend and some one invades, of course we are going to try to double team them so we can go back to having fun.

And likewise if I'm busy soloing and some troll invades with ninja flipping Havel's who hides in large groups of mobs, then I reset the game.

While if I invade someone, be it as Blue or Red, I stick to my own rules, and engage in 1 vs 1 combat, while always backing away should enemies get agroed. This means its a fair fight, and hopefully we all have fun. Of course if there are 2 of them I still try, but hold them no grudge if they gang up on me as it is their game I am joining.

Yes but you're describing an ideal situation where the host is just trying to play the PVE, a quester. Questers aren't gankers, they can gank but that doesn't make them gankers. Gankers are people who gank for the soul purpose of easy kills, they're "farming" as you say and they have no intention of moving on. Most will even use the dried finger. So, yes Invaders are invited into gankers worlds, but for the wrong reasons.

Sloth9230 wrote:Yes but you're describing an ideal situation where the host is just trying to play the PVE, a quester. Questers aren't gankers, they can gank but that doesn't make them gankers. Gankers are people who gank for the soul purpose of easy kills, they're "farming" as you say and they have no intention of moving on. Most will even use the dried finger. So, yes Invaders are invited into gankers worlds, but for the wrong reasons.

But like I said the invader is still invading. If they find a farmer and keep invading them, then bad luck to them. Maybe they should try not invading, or move to a new area.

What Sloth said. Some of them aren't even farming souls. They wait (often with phantoms) at spawn points and jump you as soon as you spawn. They do it just for fun.

Then what would you have them do? Drop a RSS? They'd still get summoned by gankers.

Invasion is just another part of the game, if you lose to an invader then treat it as learning experience and move on, it's no different then getting killed by an NPC or the environment. I used to hate invaders, but after 400 hours of PVE getting invaded is the only thing that keeps the game fresh for me.

Every now and then you'll run into a d-bag or two, but most invaders are just regular people like you.

Invasions are part of what makes this game/series unique. It is integral to the gameplay. You can summon phantoms to help you. Invaders help balance that. While they aren't welcome in your world, they belong there as much as any other enemy.

Sloth9230 wrote:Then what would you have them do? Drop a RSS? They'd still get summoned by gankers.

Invasion is just another part of the game, if you lose to an invader then treat it as learning experience and move on, it's no different then getting killed by an NPC or the environment. I used to hate invaders, but after 400 hours of PVE getting invaded is the only thing that keeps the game fresh for me.

Every now and then you'll run into a d-bag or two, but most invaders are just regular people like you.

No, if you are keen on good PVP, just go to the arena, that's what its for.

I've finished the game twice with 2 characters both with lots of coop, and got most the way through NG+ with both and having done everything the game has to offer I like to do a little PVP, since thats all thats left to do,.

The Arena is a new addition to series, before that invasions have were and still are the most popular method to PVP.

And Co-oping is the reason invasions are necessary, you need to be willing to risk something in return for that help. The game can be beat on your own if you're willing to put the effort in.

That may be why you feel this way Apr, you should try out more of the PvP scene.

Good PvP is all relative. There are many different types of "PvP'. Again, part of what makes this game so great: unique and diverse.

Back on topic, Infinite - set a moral standard that works for you. That you feel is both fair and fun. Don't deviate from that and you have no need to feel ashamed.

And wear some pants while you play, it should help reduce the shame factor.

My advice April, join the Forest Hunters. If you don't dislike Ggankers yet, then being a Forest Hunter will teach you to hate them.

And yes, Tolvo is right. Pant's are an important part of maintaining one's dignity.

Sloth9230 wrote:My advice April, join the Forest Hunters. If you don't dislike Ggankers yet, then being a Forest Hunter will teach you to hate them.

And yes, Tolvo is right. Pant's are an important part of maintaining one's dignity.

I prefer skirts personally, and have been with the forest hunters with the last 2 toons. Seems a good place to get the most pvp. And again, I cannot be angry at someone who defends themselves against an invader, it would just be silly to do so.

...

That's it, I'm done.

Just as one should not get angry at someone for invading their world and killing them, since that requires one to be human after all.

Tolvo wrote:Just as one should not get angry at someone for invading their world and killing them, since that requires one to be human after all.

Ahh the anger from that is more due to having spent 5 minutes trying to get my friends summon sign to appear in my world, only to be killed by some invader. It becomes a time waster then, for all involved.

Disconnecting on the other hand just wastes everybody's time. I especially love gamkers who disconnect after they lose. Yeah sure, I don't get anything for beating them. But there's no greater reward than knowing just how pathetic they are, and knowing that they know it too(though I'm guessing most probably won't admit to themselves how much they suck.)

aprilmanha wrote: Ahh the anger from that is more due to having spent 5 minutes trying to get my friends summon sign to appear in my world, only to be killed by some invader. It becomes a time waster then, for all involved.

Like I said. If you want help, then you best be prepared to get invaded. Co-op, without invasions, is just playing the game on easy mode.