Holy ****, they KILLED Greatswords

THat's not a nerf, that's a murder. Greatswords now swing slower then Ultra Greatswords when you two hand them.

haha lightning claymore users.

On a serious note though, I kinda wish they'd stop changing things like this. It's cool that they're fixing things, but it seems like each time they put out a new patch a couple of my toons that I considered complete become useless.

the only thing that pisses me off about it is that i cant counter roll bs as easy as before since the animation is too slow to unlock and aim behind me that it gets me killed a lot and it never happened to me before the patch. my poor msgs...its still really good though.

I've never used a Greatsword in PVP, and I still feel sorry for you GS users. I even miss getting stunlocked every time I made a mistake against one because it felt right to have the fear instilled into me when seeing a sword as big as me swinging at my face.

I dont see it? I seem to swing fine and still get the usual amount of kills before the patch/dlc.

Are you using GS's or Ultimate GS's Zakkia? I haven't noticed it with the Zwiehander, but I notice it with the MSGS

Ultra rather. Where is my head today?

where as before a greatsword class weapon could infinitely stunlock (especially certain ones like the mlgs) now you can easily roll out without toggle escaping before the second strike lands.

I used my +5 occult claymore, i guess i see the stunlock change, which kinda sucks, but in swing speed i cant really notice it. Hm.. now that i look at it, this first swing is quite slow on the gs, however the following swings are still the same speed.

i was hoping that the nerf wouldn't be so harsh on the GLGS, but no, From really make useless my only favorite weapon...

Only the second swing is much slower. They're still not as slow as UGS, UGS just have longer stagger frames so the next r1 will connect.

the thing that really pisses me off is that they nerfed the speed of the gs but they didnt take the time to nerf the speed of the bkga, i mean come on a greataxe with the speed of a damn falchion(first hit) and you need 76 poise to tank one hit lol, the ar nerf did nothing.

Rant, the BKGA suffered an invisible 20-25% damage nerf. Still a good wepon, but it's not stronger than a GS now, it just has stunlock.

^ I've actually been noticing it being a little bit weaker. I've killed a couple of BKGA users over the last few days and it's been evident to me. Although I'm also using heavy armor for the first time so I guess that could account for something too.

i did say the ar nerf didnt do anything, its still really strong and most important of all really fast for what it is. people say how easy it is to parrry but that's only if your opponent sucks and just spams r1, if you go up against someone good that's using it, its scary good.

"Deadly in the hands of a skilled player" applies to nearly every weapon and spell in the game. I think the nerf was highly appropriate, now it acts like a slower greatsword with higher poisebreak and more range (not to mention weight).

Joichiro wrote:i was hoping that the nerf wouldn't be so harsh on the GLGS, but no, From really make useless my only favorite weapon...

It's still a very good weapon. I got my 83 streak with essentially it alone. The nerf means that you can't combo r1 into r1 with anything except a Moonlight Greatsword one-handed attack. However, the time between a running attack into a r1, and rolling into an r1 still hasn't been effected. These alone provide a good enough tool set to work with.

Run + R1 -> R1 -> R2

you can also do the r1 take a half step then r1 again to do the first move in the gs combo over and over, still slower than before but not as slow as doing the second move in the combo.

Rynn wrote:THat's not a nerf, that's a murder. Greatswords now swing slower then Ultra Greatswords when you two hand them.

Yea thats what I said.

Also you can tell how badly they were nerfed not only in PVP but in PVE because enemies and NPC will now dodge or block the second swing even when their guard is supposed to be broken.

I haven't tested in pvp or anything (hell, I never do pvp), but i'm almost certain that the MLGS swings much faster than the other GS's. Just compare the swing speed of it with another GS, its not as quick as it was before the patch, but its still quick.

it's my opinion that a better fix for the stunlock issue would have been to add a few frames of invincibility after your poise was broken to allow for a quick escape or block.

if the speed of the greatswords was left alone, you'd still be able to get in an extra hit or two after breaking someone's poise, at the same time, they wouldn't get stunlocked into oblivion. this would also render the weapon swap glitch moot.

i think this would maintain a better balance between the dex and str weapons. the str weapons would maintain their ability to break poise and stun, which i think would match the dex weapons superior speed.

Honestly, I find that the slower speed makes the greatswords better.

The first time I used one after the patch, I was really surprised just how much slower they are now. It's a huge difference. I rarely ever used them to begin with (I use mainly daggers and curved swords), but I was playing on my friend's game and the only weapon he had decently upgraded was a Claymore. I was fighting Artorias (on NG+2), and when the opportunity presented itself I spammed R1... and promptly got myself killed. The sword was so slow!

But seriously, I think it's a huge improvement, because now I have a ton more fun using them. After that initial surprise, I played thoughtfully and made use of the Claymore's full moveset, and I had a blast! One of the most fun fights I've had in all my time playing Dark Souls was using the Claymore--I'd have never said that before the patch. It used to be the noob-tube of Dark Souls! Now it's actually a fun, well-rounded weapon.

Everyone b-itching about greatswords second swing speed being nerfed apparently just based their tactics around spamming 2H R1 so it's good for them to move on from stunlocking.
Onehanded GS R1 spam can still stunlock by the way if you are into it.
Damage is still good and stun is still good (after the patch even more viable) and the movesets are fairly good so what's the problem?

For me the problem is speed. The other day I got summoned to fight the Four Kings on NG+ (maybe higher) and I had to switch weapons because I wasn't doing enough damage with my GS. They are not that great for PvE anymore and that's a big issue for me at least.

Greatswords can still stunlock as they did before, you just can't use simple R1 spamming and have to think about your combos a bit, that's all.

BKGA, while strong, is pathetic to parry, but it hurts if you fail.

Based by people I meet online, nobody cares much about the nerf. There's still a ton of BKGA and Claymore/MLGS users.