@@KARMIC JUSTICE Explained (with video) @@

Even though the damage depends on the adj of the weapon on yoru right hand, KJ's damage also scaled from your Faith or Int, right?

Will the damage you inflict be similar if you only have the required Faith for KJ?

Yes. I always cast with my left hand and the damage scaled with the "normal" techniques. Now a brief disclaimer....I might not have tried different talismans to cast it during any single session of testing so I'm not 100% on how that affects it but:

I did test it with dusk crown and equipment that enhances miracle damage and the results stayed the same. Both increased and KJ always ended up, approximately, half the damage that WoG did suggesting that it was still basing damage consistently with my character (aka, still using my attributes to some degree)


I can't do much testing with others thanks to weird internet so I tested in the Parish. The Balder trio will always give you a fun test. For a more controlled test, the sword soldier and the crossbow soldier near the stairs leading to Andre consistently trigger it. I would stand in the little doorway with a grass crest shield and let them both hit me.

If you're only doing half the damage of a WotG despite having those damage increasing equipment, i doubt the damage from KJ with a just an enchanted/divine weapon would fare any better. But i'm going to test it too.

Well remember that the equipment was also boosting WoG since I would test both with the same gear and compare. I think using a right handed weapon with a modifier would have boosted it tremendously (the OP's video would suggest that's the case I think too). I was more so testing at the Parish the number of hits and how fast they needed to be to trigger it. I wanted to know viability in PvP but of course didn't want to sacrifice my primary weapon for the task. Basically, I wasn't looking to determine if KJ could replace my setup, but enhance it.

^I'm thinking of that as well. Because the build i'm making is a shield build, even if i were to go for the elemental paths, the damage don't seem to scale for Faith or Int so i'm thinking if the damage will be sufficient enough with minimum req to use the spell and having a standard elemental shield.

I can't test it since i'm still working right now but i'm excited to try it out once i'm free.

Glad you found my thread helpful.

Anyway, to everyone going to make KJ builds, the truth is that while they are to use, skilled players won't fall for it, and to 1shot decent builds you need both to be at hyper mode AND to have a lot of intelligence. So, you know, my Composite Bow +15 says it ain't going to work against me

I've had one person try it on me. Let's just say it's less than effective against a defensive minded fighter with a Great Scythe. There's no way I'm going to meet the hit threshold to trigger it.

I've always maintained that the best use is psychological. Although threads like this diminish that advantage

The less people know about, the more cautious they'll be around it. It can create openings by making the opponent doubt his ability to attack you.

To answer a few questions...

This video was done with 20 faith (minimum faith to cast KJ), and from my tests I found that faith made no difference at all to the damage (unless you cast it with a talisman in right hand, then the faith would increase the magic adjust, and thus the damage

Magic/Enchanted/Divine/Occult weapons do provide some good damage based on the magic damage they provide. This is also the case with moonlight weapons, velkas rapier, astoras sword, catch pole etc (Anything with magic damage included)

Buffs do not increase the damage in any way ever. Even spell swapping them onto weapons with magic damage, and even talismans / catalysts.

ALL melee hits on the final hit for the activation, will be a counter hit and completely unavoidable (Pokes behind a shield may be blocked but would still be counter damage) I tested this loads with another player and found no way to hit and roll immediately to avoid the explosion. Magic hits like soul mass can obviously be normal hits since they can activate the explosion after you are finished casting.

"I frames" DO count toward the build up, just think of it that anytime a roll would build bleed or poison, it builds the activation for KJ, so you could in fact just roll in circles around a katana spammer and blow em up with out being hit.

And finally the spell is literally useless if you arent holding something with magic damage / magic adjust in your right hand at the time of activation, as Rynn said, the damage is 250 (If that) and really not worth the hassle



I think the most practical use of KJ is on a faith build with an elemental side arm (Divine katana, occult balder sword etc) That way the damage would still be pretty good (also depending on suns ring and dusk crown) and you would still have offensive capabilities.

Chiz is right, it wont work on skilled players, but you dont know how good someone will be when invading, so is worth a cast if you have no other buffs going on. And even in duels against the best players, its a great deterrent against fire surge, dark bead, pursuers and soul mass (All of which are like instant activations)

=)

KJ is those kinds of spells that work in random invasions against inexperienced players or simple minded gankers, in most cases.

Let's just face it.

The best reason to use it is because the aura is amazing!

So just to give some rough, inaccurate testing.

On the hollows in the parish: These are counter hits btw.

Fist: 250 damage
90 magic damage: 190 damage
120 magic damage: 270 damage
140 magic damage: 330 damage
150 magic damage: 345 damage
200 magic damage: 505 damage
165 magic adjust: 455 damage
230 magic adjust: 1182 damage


Expect better results if your damage is buffed in any way, remember that hollows in the parish have 21 magic defense, so this is the absolute BEST damage possible. If your weapon doesn't have about 110 magic AR, using it will actually weaken your results. Most magic or enchanted weapons have about 250 magic AR: which I estimate would give approximately 500 damage on a counter hit in PvP without a buff.

This is not likely accurate testing, I just took a few points of data as I leveled up a character.

Does Mayhem know if adding poise to your build increases the amount of hits required for it to activate?

The video shows light armor and five hits. I used Black Iron. Five hits

So is it always just 5 hits? Or does a higher defense rating increase the meter?

I only ever tested in black iron and five hits was the minimum. Mayhem says it perfect in that it's like the bleed or poison meter. If you take four and the person backs off maybe it will be seven hits (4+3 for example). If they back off for even three or four seconds in my experience the meter completely resets. The video (which was cool by the way) is same results with lighter armor so my guess is five is the magic number.

Does having an ascended glove in your right hand also work ? 230 adjust ?

does the weapon with the magic adjust need to be in your right hand and being used at the time KJ goes boom or can you have it in the second slot?

for example: i cast KJ using the canvas talisman in my left hand while in my right hand i'm using a +15 MSGS but i have a +10 divine broadsword in the second right hand slot. would i need to switch my MSGS to the broadsword for the magic adjust to have any effect on KJ?

also: if i cast KJ with the canvas talisman in my right hand, does it still matter what i have in the right or am i free to swap the talisman for a different weapon (moving it to my inventory)?

Nybbles wrote:does the weapon with the magic adjust need to be in your right hand and being used at the time KJ goes boom or can you have it in the second slot?

for example: i cast KJ using the canvas talisman in my left hand while in my right hand i'm using a +15 MSGS but i have a +10 divine broadsword in the second right hand slot. would i need to switch my MSGS to the broadsword for the magic adjust to have any effect on KJ?

also: if i cast KJ with the canvas talisman in my right hand, does it still matter what i have in the right or am i free to swap the talisman for a different weapon (moving it to my inventory)?

Its at the time of the bang, so yes you would need to swap to the one with the magic damage in order to get the best out of it.

And yes you can cast it with a talisman in right hand then swap to something else, but the damage always depends on the magic adjust at the time of the bang.

For example, my build in the video has 20 faith, I could have cast that with darkmoon talisman (Would be real low mag adj because not enough minimum stats) and STILL get massive damage if I swapped in time for the bang.

i see … thanks Mayhem

Just tried an experimental KJ Mage build in the forest. It is so powerful. You cast HJ. They come spamming R1. 1,000 damage and a knockdown (unless their poise is cranked up). Then, a quick Dark Bead and 99% of them are dead. Tried this in the forest, and it was almost like god mode.

reim0027 wrote:Just tried an experimental KJ Mage build in the forest. It is so powerful. You cast HJ. They come spamming R1. 1,000 damage and a knockdown (unless their poise is cranked up). Then, a quick Dark Bead and 99% of them are dead. Tried this in the forest, and it was almost like god mode.

Nice! I have never actually had KJ not knock people down, im not sure whether it has more knock down the wotg or just because its almost always a counter hit, I think ill give it a test with someone in full havels and a wolf ring

Having your cake and eating it too:
This won't work for low levels as much but here goes a sneaky build for KJ that would also be viable for many other things. So, interestingly enough, on Balder soldiers the GSoA is not far behind the tin crystallization catalyst as a right hand KJ modifier. I didn't get much action tonight in the forest but I went in with black iron legs and hands, Artorias chest, and Dusk Crown. Havel's ring paired with ring of the sun's firstborn. GSoA in my right hand. Grass Crest shield and talisman in my left. So midroll, decent armor (probably could have taken more than 30 seconds and gotten even better), and KJ output on a balder soldier of 1300 (ng++++). I got in only a few fights but I cast KJ each time. Despite my ears, no one approached me like I was a caster. The first guy was a backstabber so no way KJ is gonna trigger. This is the beauty here.....I just switched my right hand weapon to my default great scythe. Now I'm not just viable, I'm dangerous. Second person is an elemental weapon spammer. Never seemed to notice I was letting her hit my shield. KJ rattled her so bad she didn't recover. I blasted her with a WoG too for grins but after KJ bursts, the GS is back in play. I only hit her three times. High level, heavy armor and vit gouge.
1 KJ (missed the damage amount)
1 WoG for about 500
1 R1 attack with the GS (one handed) and it was my fight