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    Why I won't be fighting in the SL101-200 arena bracket

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    Why I won't be fighting in the SL101-200 arena bracket Empty Why I won't be fighting in the SL101-200 arena bracket

    Post by Ghadis_God Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:23 pm

    This build http://tinyurl.com/9vyu73k is the reason why I won't be fighting in the 101-150 SL bracket in the DLC arena. Everyone and their mother will be rolling this tryhard build and I predict that all we'll be doing is fighting against buffed Washing poles. This is why I'm not making a build above SL100 from now on. I was hesitant to say it at first, but 120 is dead if all that'll happen in the arena is fights against these types of people



    Last edited by Ghadis_God on Tue Oct 02, 2012 8:42 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post by Siegfried. Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:33 pm

    The range is actually 101-200. Fifty levels are going to make a huge difference, given that this range allows people to max out every relevant stat according to their build and then choose to empower auxiliary stats or take others beyond the levels of diminishing returns.

    One flaw in your calculations, in any case, is the poise value. With the greatsword nerf, we'll probably see people trying to hit the 76 break point rather than the 53 one.
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    Post by callipygias Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:37 pm

    I really enjoy the 100-200. Watching a guy Crystal up his Mura and knowing I'm going for the parry is pretty thrilling. Lower levels are cool too, but at sl 100 you figure after 3 Wraths your opponent is more than likely out, at 200 he could have 30 of them for all I know.
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    Post by Ghadis_God Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:39 pm

    I'm pretty sure it's 50-level intervals, and there are greatsword techniques that bypass the stunlock nerf depending on which GS you're using. I think the real necessary breakpoint come the DLC is 36 for katanas and polearms, but that won't stop people from going for 54. I won't be using this build personally, I'm just predicting what people will do, and 54 is a popular breakpoint.
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    Post by Rynn Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:55 pm

    http://tinyurl.com/8jsdhnp
    Real tryhard build.
    In the arena, buffs never last more then a minute before death. This gives more AR, more damage when two handing, and overall just better damage.
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    Post by Siegfried. Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:57 pm

    I know about the greatsword nerf workaround, but even using that, they're more difficult to get consistent stunlocks with than in the past. And I'm absolutely sure the range is 101-200, and I think the tier after that has an even larger range.

    In any case, given that everyone who PvPs over 100 and not at the 120/125 range will be at around SL200, this build won't be much of an issue. Underpowered, in fact, compared to the diverse potential of SL200 builds.
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    Post by Ghadis_God Tue Oct 02, 2012 8:41 pm

    I actually disagree, a SL200 won't be appreciably better unless End or Vit are gouged. It really only gives room to bump Int, which gives generally weaker buffs. Also, it takes so long to get to 200 that I think fewer people will be fighting at that level.
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    Post by Rynn Tue Oct 02, 2012 8:47 pm

    the ranges are 1-50, 51-100, and 101-200. The next tier is just labeled "200+"
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    Post by Siegfried. Tue Oct 02, 2012 9:23 pm

    Ghadis_God wrote:I actually disagree, a SL200 won't be appreciably better unless End or Vit are gouged. It really only gives room to bump Int, which gives generally weaker buffs. Also, it takes so long to get to 200 that I think fewer people will be fighting at that level.

    Endurance gouging is a huge deal, though, since how one spends their endurance defines what equipment they can use while maintaining speed. For instance, with my paladin build, SL120 - SL200 is the difference between it being a solid faith build and a fast-rolling quality build with maxed faith abilities, 76+ poise and 400+ defense.

    With that much endurance, more players will be able to afford to diversify their gear much more, supporting the return of heavier weapons and armours into the metagame. Suddenly, Knight, Black Iron, Havel's and Giant's are no longer the only efficient heavy armour pieces, and players can combine these with heavy weapons while maintaining speed. Or hell, even use greatshields.

    With that diversity of stat allocation, I see SL200 PvP being much less predictable than anything we've seen in the past. More builds will fall into a kind of singularity due to the diminishing returns convergence, at least when it comes to stats, but those additional stats will justify the use of different rings, weapons, armour and shields.
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    Post by Glutebrah Tue Oct 02, 2012 10:46 pm

    Check our my SL200 build in sig, its king.

    It took me less then 4 hours to get to 200
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    Post by RagingPanic Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:10 pm

    This is why I will not be playing the new arena in the DLC. I like 120(125) because that's the way it's been since Demon's Souls. I don't see any reason to play the new arena, but it's also not a huge problem anyway. Diminished returns would only let people have access to some more stuff, and max out a stat or two. People who play in the arena I feel will play to win, not to better themselves or have fun. That's why I wouldn't play. Not that people will use tryhard classes, they've been doing that since ever. The rest of us would just have figure out a new way to counter it, which shouldn't be hard because of all the new Spells/Equipment. Sorry for writing so much, I have a lot to say about things.
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    Post by Ghadis_God Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:11 pm

    From scratch, or after duping Souls? Or using a massive stockpile of PvP souls from dueling at SL120? Or did you invade the forest and get plenty of kills of high-levels? Or did you host anywhere?
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    Post by Glutebrah Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:13 pm

    Ghadis_God wrote:From scratch, or after duping Souls? Or using a massive stockpile of PvP souls from dueling at SL120? Or did you invade the forest and get plenty of kills of high-levels? Or did you host anywhere?

    He was my old SL120 for fight club with millions of souls, he also had 99 souls of gwyn I fed to framptt
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    Post by Rynn Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:18 pm

    Btw, SL120 PvP has disproven your theory of builds devolving.
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    Post by Jansports Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:22 pm

    http://mugenmonkey.com/darksouls/?c=2420857941444737

    200 arena will be fun.

    well assuming your idea of fun includes buffs, and gouging.
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    Post by Rynn Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:30 pm

    200 arena WILL be fun.
    You have outlined one of MANY builds players will use.
    There will ALWAYS be the mini-max build. Level 1-49 has it, 50-99 has it, and 100-199 has it. You will NEVER have a level tier that doesn't objectively have the best possible build in it.
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    Post by Glutebrah Wed Oct 03, 2012 12:22 am

    Jansports wrote:http://mugenmonkey.com/darksouls/?c=2420857941444737

    200 arena will be fun.

    well assuming your idea of fun includes buffs, and gouging.



    my SL200 has no gouging, has 1500HP (60more HP then ym SL100), hits weaker (517 split damage comapred to 450 pure)

    i kept with my same formula of fun, no buffs/14-1500HP/40 Poise. i am looking forward to it.
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    Post by Ghadis_God Wed Oct 03, 2012 12:51 am

    I know, Rynn, but buffed WP users are the most annoying people to fight on the planet. I'm guessing it's not so much a problem on PC because a lot of new players are just starting to figure out how to optimize the metagame, but on consoles it will likely be instantaneous. My FH 200+ bracket toon will be rolling an Ornstein cosplay in the arena as well as an Artorias one, for pure fun, but I'm going to stay away from 100-200 because it feels to me like the tryhards will have cooled down after 200, it's so high it feels less competitive and more like veterans playing around with personal variations of essentially all the same stats. But below that there are going to be a lot of people with something to prove.
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    Post by Rynn Wed Oct 03, 2012 1:03 am

    Buffed Washingpoles are the best build ingame at level 120 as well, and yet we don't see them everywhere.
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    Post by Ghadis_God Wed Oct 03, 2012 1:06 am

    True enough, but that's usually because most people like to invest in one scaling and one buffing stat at SL120. So we see buffed uchis and iaitos and bss', but at 150 and especially 200 split scaling becomes more viable for buffing, hence the WP.
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    Post by Jansports Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:51 am

    Buffed BSS are the best builds in game and we don't see them everywhere...

    At 120 buffing certainly is a thing to do, but Pole #1 weapon in the game? I'm not convinced. It's scaling isn't strong enough compared to other options and really it's just long, not that being long isn't an advantage.
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    Post by WyrmHero Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:37 am

    We can also see max out DSS builds, at 27/40/40. Katanas are very weak against spears, so I wouldn't be so scared of a buffed WP Ghadis. I wpuld just take out my DSS/SKS/Horn backup and annoy them instead of them annoying me.
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    Post by Jovias-86 Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:20 am

    I have a Sl157 something with no Int or Faith and 1 att slot happy
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    Post by reim0027 Wed Oct 03, 2012 9:19 am

    If DMB and CMW become predominant, then, I'm guessing Crest Shield and GMB will become just as prominent.
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    Post by Glutebrah Wed Oct 03, 2012 11:10 am

    reim0027 wrote:If DMB and CMW become predominant, then, I'm guessing Crest Shield and GMB will become just as prominent.

    my SL200 build will focus on DSS and VoW and GMB since every one and there mother in that bracket will be heavy casters/weapon buffers


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