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    Lightening Avelyn

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    Post by Glutebrah Sun Oct 14, 2012 3:06 pm

    i assume the answer is yes... but just curious if this got hit with the 10% nerf also since aveyln +15 doesn't scale.

    it would be silly if the Lightening Avelyn which does 273 damage be nerfed down to 246 damage. when a +15 does 229 damage. (these don't factor in arrows because arrows stay the same.)

    it seems even at low levels there is zero point to the Lightening Avelyn
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    Post by Knight Alundil Sun Oct 14, 2012 3:54 pm

    This really shocks me man. The avelyn is awesome! You have to remember, it's229 per bolt, and you can blast three bolts pretty damn fast.
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    Post by Spurgun Sun Oct 14, 2012 4:02 pm

    He's saying that there's no use to a lightning avelyn when you can use a +15 instead.

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    Post by Knight Alundil Sun Oct 14, 2012 4:08 pm

    Ahhh ok. Well most of the time i'm not trying to do considerable damage with my avelyn. It's in my off left hand so its mostly there to catch by surprise or chip. 17 damage can make a difference especially when physical resistance is generally higher stacked than lightning.
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    Post by Glutebrah Sun Oct 14, 2012 4:15 pm

    Does any one know for sure if the lightening avelyn was in fact nerfed??
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    Post by Knight Alundil Sun Oct 14, 2012 4:27 pm

    Well all elementals were so I would assume so yes.
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    Post by Veradox Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:42 am

    By the way, does Lightning Avelyn do more damage with Lightning bolts? Considering that Fire Bow used to increase Fire damage of Fire Arrows...
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    Post by vatar5 Mon Oct 15, 2012 5:11 am

    ^Yep
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    Post by Glutebrah Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:49 am

    still though if the avelyn does get nerfed another 10% damage i don't see there ever being a reason for it.

    when you look at other weapons like the Uchi vs Lightening Uchi at base stats to weild an Uchi a Lightening one is double the AR since there isn't any scaling going into the +15

    but with avelyn a non scaling weapon the lightening version isn't that much more powerful then the +15.. the gap of damage is much like a +15 uchi at 40 dex vs a lightening, and we all know the +15 out damages it then.

    i will just be sad if i have to switch to a +15 one on my SL50 only because the triple shot lightening looks cook
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    Post by Knight Alundil Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:00 pm

    Are you just looking at the numbers on your character status screen?

    You have to remember that physical protection is generally always alot higher than lightning, so that widens the gap by a fair chunk.
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    Post by Glutebrah Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:33 pm

    yea i am looking at numbers. but what i am referring to is more or less this comparison.

    An Uchigatana does the following damage

    +15 14dex 225AR
    lightening pre nerf 498AR, post nerf around 450AR
    +15 40dex 420AR

    dispute physical resistance being higher that +15 with 40 dex will out damage the Lightening version because of split damages. but if you have base stats obviously the Lightening version is better because it is more then double AR.

    Avelyn has no scaling, so the damage at base stats:

    +15 229AR + Heavy Bolt 64AR = 293AR
    Lightening avelyn after 10% nerf does 246AR + lightening bolt 116AR = 362AR

    so the damage difference is only 70AR, while the damage difference of the Uchi was 80AR and the pure physical Uchi would out damage the lightening one, it is fair to assume a pure physical avelyn with less of a damage gap will out perform the lightening one also.

    hope that makes sense... crossbows are different then most other weapons because any other weapon in the game if you stay at minimum stats required to weild the weapon, an elemental version will do more damage. but since Cross bows don't scale the +15 is at max damage at base states.

    if an Uchi did 420AR at only 14 dex no one would ever make the lightening version. they just need to add scaling to crossbows imo.
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    Post by vatar5 Mon Oct 15, 2012 4:30 pm

    70 AR is quite a lot,just saying.

    Besides fire is the way to go as a lot of armors have high phy res and lightning res.
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    Post by Glutebrah Mon Oct 15, 2012 4:43 pm

    Go test out a 700+ lightening zwei and then a 600 pure physical zwei and see if that extra 100AR matters.
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    Post by WyrmHero Mon Oct 15, 2012 4:51 pm

    I did some tests and post them on a thread. This is of course pre DLC, and SL 120. For lower SL and post DLC, will have to test again.


    Test results at SL 120:

    Armor: mom + chain armor + BI gaunts + Havel's legs

    Avelyn +15 with heavy bolts = 293 AR
    Damage = 297

    Lightning Avelyn with lightning bolts = 389 AR
    Damage = 324

    Naked:
    Normal: 621 damage
    Lightning: 555 damage


    By the way Heavy Crossbow results:

    Normal: 405 AR
    Damage: 207

    Lightning: 523 AR
    Damage: 185




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    Post by WyrmHero Mon Oct 15, 2012 5:08 pm

    I understand what you're trying to imply glute, however I recommend you just choose the 1 you like the most. The various resistances at low SL could mean your lightning 1 will do more damage than the normal, or not. Being struck by 3 lightning bolts also has a psychological effect on your opponent, as the sound of lightning can make someone nervous/surprised. You can also choose it to match the theme of your build, ie. your toon loves lightning. It any case choose the one you have the most fun with.
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    Post by Glutebrah Mon Oct 15, 2012 5:25 pm

    That blows my mind that lightening which has more base AR did less damage on a naked opponent..... Are you sure about those numbers??
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    Post by vatar5 Mon Oct 15, 2012 5:46 pm

    Maybe somehow,naked character has actually higher natural resistance for lightning than physical...
    If this is true,the player may be the son/daughter of Gwyn...
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    Post by Glutebrah Mon Oct 15, 2012 6:14 pm

    I have one of each so not that worried. I was just curious to know if any one knew for a fact it got nerfed, and imo would make no sense since cross bows don't scale and was already out damaged by a +15 in some cases.

    And imo the point of elementals is you use them when you don't have enough of the primary scaling stat for that weapon. but with cross bows that isn't the case

    I'll find out though,
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    Post by WyrmHero Mon Oct 15, 2012 6:39 pm

    Glutebrah wrote:That blows my mind that lightening which has more base AR did less damage on a naked opponent..... Are you sure about those numbers??

    Yeah I was pretty surprised to see the physical one winning. It makes a bit of sense though, seeing as naked defenses are somewhat equally distributed (around 150 overall defense), meanwhile with armor you can have ~350 physical and ~230 lightning.
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    Post by RANT Tue Oct 16, 2012 12:03 am

    do what i have been doing for months and get a heavy xbow+15.
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    Post by Glutebrah Tue Oct 16, 2012 12:21 am

    Something like about the avelyn + washing pole makes me hhhnnnnnnnnnnnnggggggggggg
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    Post by WyrmHero Tue Oct 16, 2012 12:45 am

    I've been doing crystal light crossbows. They're easy to farm at the Burg bonfire archer. Same AR as normal +15 heavy but lighter.

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