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meridam99
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    My research on BS damage.

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    Post by JY4answer Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:31 pm

    I did some tests on the black knights at the kiln, not PvPers though, so I dunno how reliable this is. I had 28 str, 40 dex, and I was 2 handing for all of these. I tried a bunch of +14 weapons for BSs, and here's what I find for damage.

    Rapier > Estoc > Mail breaker > Bandits knife

    Sounds ridiculous I know, considering the critical damage is what the B knife is known for. I figured that the type of physical damage is to blame.

    As most of you would know, almost all armors have highest slash damage defense, followed by thrusting, lowest on smashing. Thats why a smough hammer/dragon tooth/huge club can squish you like a bug even though the AR doesnt seem that good.

    B knife does slashing damage, so I understand why it might do less damage than the mail breaker, depending on the armor. Then theres the rapier that has 110 critical compared to 120 for mail breaker. Most of you might guess that the higher normal damage of the rapier would overcome the lower critical bonus.

    Finally there's the Estoc with its even higher normal damage, doing marginally less damage in a BS than the rapier. I'm sure most of you would agree that you can make up for that from a longer range R1 poke that hurts more.

    So to conclude. Estoc might be the best weapon to do critical hits. That's why I was loving it that much without even realising why I was punishing all these farmers by sticking my Estoc thru their sorry chests. One thing though. If the opponent has light armor, then the B knive would definitely do more damage. The choice here is whether to gain more with a B knife when the enemy is in light armor, or to lose less using an Estoc/rapier when they're in heavy armor.
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    Post by Akatik Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:32 pm

    That's BS. Sorry, had to be done.


    Good information btw.


    So, using your logic, a backstab from a hammer would be the most powerful melee attack in the game.


    Last edited by Akatik on Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:36 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post by meridam99 Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:33 pm

    I will beat everyone else to the punch...do you have some empirical info (numbers) so we can compare?
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    Post by JY4answer Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:34 pm

    Sorry, but I didn't record the numbers My research on BS damage. 1330857165
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    Post by meridam99 Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:35 pm

    Akatik wrote:That's BS. Sorry, had to be done.


    Good information btw.

    Did you mean that is only for BackStab or are you calling "Bull Crap" on the post? That partially why I asked for numbers so we can compare the evidence.
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    Post by JY4answer Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:36 pm

    meridam99 wrote:
    Akatik wrote:That's BS. Sorry, had to be done.


    Good information btw.

    Did you mean that is only for BackStab or are you calling "Bull Crap" on the post? That partially why I asked for numbers so we can compare the evidence.

    Its a joke lol.
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    Post by strangejoy Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:38 pm

    I guess that's not too surprising. It's been known for a while that the thrusting swords are bs and riposte superstars.

    I wonder where ricard's and velka's rapiers fall along this spectrum. Like meridam, I would love to see actualy numbers.
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    Post by JY4answer Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:40 pm

    strangejoy wrote:I guess that's not too surprising. It's been known for a while that the thrusting swords are bs and riposte superstars.

    I wonder where ricard's and velka's rapiers fall along this spectrum. Like meridam, I would love to see actualy numbers.

    Sure. Anyone wanna get stabbed by me over and over? I want data on different armors on players. My research on BS damage. 3358384175
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    Post by Akatik Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:42 pm

    If crushing damage is the least protected by armor, then a hammer could potentially deal amazing damage.

    I need to try this out.
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    Post by Dilby Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:26 pm

    Maybe its time i take smoughs out of my bottomless box........ teehee
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    Post by Serious_Much Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:37 pm

    JY4answer wrote:Sure. Anyone wanna get stabbed by me over and over? I want data on different armors on players. My research on BS damage. 3358384175

    lol, loving that.

    maybe you should just become a lagstabbing little ***** for one night just to test this stuff out? silly
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    Post by somebody_else Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:47 pm

    JY4answer wrote:Sounds ridiculous I know, considering the critical damage is what the B knife is known for. I figured that the type of physical damage is to blame.

    you're wrong here. Bandits dagger is known becouse it has downright n00b wide angle of successful backstab. not for damage. it executes backstab where other weapons fail.

    one weapon having so wide angle is downright stupid mistake on Froms part
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    Post by JY4answer Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:45 pm

    somebody_else wrote:
    JY4answer wrote:Sounds ridiculous I know, considering the critical damage is what the B knife is known for. I figured that the type of physical damage is to blame.

    you're wrong here. Bandits dagger is known becouse it has downright n00b wide angle of successful backstab. not for damage. it executes backstab where other weapons fail.

    one weapon having so wide angle is downright stupid mistake on Froms part

    Are you sure about this? I've done tests on the BS box as well, but after around 20 BSs with a B knife and another 20 with a claymore it feels the same to me. Maybe its just that people that use a B knife just go for BSs, and with lag it feels like a bigger box. I've had my character spun 90 degrees and BSed because of lag all the time.
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    Post by somebody_else Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:00 am

    JY4answer wrote:
    somebody_else wrote:
    JY4answer wrote:Sounds ridiculous I know, considering the critical damage is what the B knife is known for. I figured that the type of physical damage is to blame.

    you're wrong here. Bandits dagger is known becouse it has downright n00b wide angle of successful backstab. not for damage. it executes backstab where other weapons fail.

    one weapon having so wide angle is downright stupid mistake on Froms part

    Are you sure about this? I've done tests on the BS box as well, but after around 20 BSs with a B knife and another 20 with a claymore it feels the same to me. Maybe its just that people that use a B knife just go for BSs, and with lag it feels like a bigger box. I've had my character spun 90 degrees and BSed because of lag all the time.

    test against in game enemies (there is no lag). it is especially noticeable when you do pivot backstab and try to miss, not wait for perfect moment where every weapon succeeds. you'll notice how knife will still backstab in most of the times.

    this difference gets lost with your ability to backstab. once you know how to backstab, you won't feel difference, just like parry with small shields. if you parry with those your timing gets perfected way more than with "parry on the wheels" and with time you even find it easier probably. but, for beginner to start with parry, "parry on the wheels" is way easier.
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    Post by JY4answer Tue Jan 31, 2012 1:55 pm

    somebody_else wrote:
    JY4answer wrote:
    somebody_else wrote:
    JY4answer wrote:Sounds ridiculous I know, considering the critical damage is what the B knife is known for. I figured that the type of physical damage is to blame.

    you're wrong here. Bandits dagger is known becouse it has downright n00b wide angle of successful backstab. not for damage. it executes backstab where other weapons fail.

    one weapon having so wide angle is downright stupid mistake on Froms part

    Are you sure about this? I've done tests on the BS box as well, but after around 20 BSs with a B knife and another 20 with a claymore it feels the same to me. Maybe its just that people that use a B knife just go for BSs, and with lag it feels like a bigger box. I've had my character spun 90 degrees and BSed because of lag all the time.

    test against in game enemies (there is no lag). it is especially noticeable when you do pivot backstab and try to miss, not wait for perfect moment where every weapon succeeds. you'll notice how knife will still backstab in most of the times.

    this difference gets lost with your ability to backstab. once you know how to backstab, you won't feel difference, just like parry with small shields. if you parry with those your timing gets perfected way more than with "parry on the wheels" and with time you even find it easier probably. but, for beginner to start with parry, "parry on the wheels" is way easier.

    So you're saying instead of the angle of the BS box behind the enemies back being bigger, its the angle of my BS hitbox being bigger? Never tried that. More research is due.

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