the best overall weapon/build

Pike has a horrible running R1. Set it off by accident and your match is effectively lost, unless your opponent is an idiot or afk.

I think the best all-rounder weapon is the MLGS, actually. Deals decent BS damage, stunlocks hard, has a ranged attack built in, and it's also generally quick enough to be practical in a duel (unless your opponent is using a fast weapon).

@Ice Um? Yeah? The demon spear recovers faster i think, but its definitely shorter than the dragonslayer spear, and both are WAY longer than the pike.

@Bro, you mean like the spears and katana we're discussing? They're not only faster, but longer than the mlgs. Or do you mean like the dmb falchion guys?

Forum Pirate wrote:@Ice Um? Yeah? The demon spear recovers faster i think, but its definitely shorter than the dragonslayer spear, and both are WAY longer than the pike.

No.

Demon's is longer than DSS. As are the moonlight horn and the silver knight spear.

I can attest to this, if you poke from a certain distance with any of the three above listed weapons and your foe pokes with his DSS, you are assured a hit while he will whiff.

Crap, the demons is longer, the other 2 arn't.

https://soulswiki.forumotion.com/t8112-spear-comparison?highlight=spear+length

Forum Pirate wrote:Crap, the demons is longer, the other 2 arn't.

https://soulswiki.forumotion.com/t8112-spear-comparison?highlight=spear+length

Funny, I thought the the SKSS was longer than the DSS. Maybe it's because I was fighting a German guy and his Eurolag was getting in the way but I swear he was outranging my DSS consistently.

Forum Pirate wrote:
@Bro, you mean like the spears and katana we're discussing? They're not only faster, but longer than the mlgs. Or do you mean like the dmb falchion guys?

Yeah, you have to time your attacks when you duel spear/katana guys with a greatsword. But greatswords are still great all-rounders, they can do many things the quicker weapons can't (as I mentioned above).

The MLGS in particular covers gank situations, duels, ranged punishments for fireball whiffs, stunlocking and procs lag hits like a claymore.

Are you kidding about the pike's r1? It's awesome, great for punishing healers and runners once you learn how to time it. It can get upwards of 500 damage on a heavy armored opponent.

I suck with greatswords, so I wouldn't know how good the mlgs is.

From experience, between the dss and the fast roll I can roll poke through all 20 of a gankers flasks and a good 20 humanity before I kill them, without healing myself, possibly even without being hit. Its an absurdly effective weapon, it will even out dps most unbuffed weapons if cornered.

Its a 1 trick pony, but so is a nuclear bomb. (exageration)

@Ghadis Runners aren't terribly consistent with their movement. Also, you have to be relatively close to make sure the trajectory doesn't skew after you start it (and if you were that close, you should have gotten the BS anyway).

Additionally, if you get the angle wrong, you can't correct it. You'll be there charging into empty space while they chug their 3 +7 estuses. Meanwhile, if you get it correct, a BS would have probably done a similar amount of damage (or more) anyway.

Also, it takes up the spot of a less situational R1. Opportunity cost.

Forum Pirate wrote:I suck with greatswords, so I wouldn't know how good the mlgs is.

From experience, between the dss and the fast roll I can roll poke through all 20 of a gankers flasks and a good 20 humanity before I kill them, without healing myself, possibly even without being hit. Its an absurdly effective weapon, it will even out dps most unbuffed weapons if cornered.

Its a 1 trick pony, but so is a nuclear bomb. (exageration)

And his buddy just sits there letting you lol roll/poke? o_0

You can dodge around two people with a spear, I do it in the forest too. I just start having trouble when they both start bs fishing at the same time.

Cant stop me. Just keep poking. Its like herding cattle, except they can't trample me if they're spooked. Just keep them both in front of me.

i like running with a Bastard sword and the SK spear. i get both power and range on my 40/40 build.

The washing poles 2h r2 has crazy range, i wouldn't be surprised if it
surpassed the demon spear r1

@Ghadis
PSN ganks don't BS fish all the time, every time?

What, really? Xbox ones do. :\

@forum I dunno, rolling in the forest in a 2v1 is a great way to get lagstabbed/rollstabbed. Maybe I'll try it sometime, I don't think it worked out when I tried it months ago though.

We already had this discussion, the MLGS is the best weapon in the game because it's fromsoftware's signature "ultima weapon". The sword appears in DeS and in their old games it was the best weapon you could find.

Its one handed R1 moveset sucks though.

The washing pole r2 is longer than the dss r1 elf.

I don't have problems. Stay confident without being aggressive, never attack as they're moving forward, and keep them at the edge of your range. I usually destroy them. If you screw up, wog can save you, buy you time to get distance.

Wouldn't it take terribly long though.

And if you make one mistake it's one shot BS game over for you.

WyrmHero wrote:We already had this discussion, the MLGS is the best weapon in the game because it's fromsoftware's signature "ultima weapon". The sword appears in DeS and in their old games it was the best weapon you could find.

Not from my experience playing against it. I can out-range it,
easily roll-through it's magic attack, it's easy to turtle and to
parry, it's only good feature is its stun-lock capability, but
76+ poise and high mobility means you rarely ever get locked.

I know it's not the best for PvP but officially it's the best weapon in the game. But in my opinion the spears are the best weapons for PvP.

OrnsteinBro wrote:Wouldn't it take terribly long though.

And if you make one mistake it's one shot BS game over for you.

Counter bs. The same can be said of any weapon. It does take a little while, but the reach is an effective buffer. Its tough to bs a quick dss user. Last I checked, towards the end of its range it can't even be roll bs punished. You may as well be attacking from orbit if you can keep them from trying to rush you. If they rush you then wog, backpeddaling with your shield up until you have space, or a backstab will all work. Use the leo ring, too, it will go faster.

WyrmHero wrote:I know it's not the best for PvP but officially it's the best weapon in the game. But in my opinion the spears are the best weapons for PvP.

Spears are good, though its easy to just turtle and bleed them.

Forum Pirate wrote:

OrnsteinBro wrote:Wouldn't it take terribly long though.

And if you make one mistake it's one shot BS game over for you.

Counter bs. The same can be said of any weapon. It does take a little while, but the reach is an effective buffer. Its tough to bs a quick dss user. Last I checked, towards the end of its range it can't even be roll bs punished. You may as well be attacking from orbit if you can keep them from trying to rush you. If they rush you then wog, backpeddaling with your shield up until you have space, or a backstab will all work. Use the leo ring, too, it will go faster.

In my experience, the German/Spanish players can BS punish all spears (including demon's) owing to heavy lag. You can have rolled away and then be standing up but just a tad too far away for your poke to reach them- and after that you'll watch them circle the spot you were standing at prior to the roll and BOOM oneshot BS'd.

So I usually just resort to counter bs whenever they even look like they're approaching. Works infinitely better (almost literally).

Because DkS was meant to be balanced, the MLGS couldn't be a step above other weapons like in other games. I'd say that the GSoA with max stats is the "best" weapon, I didn't mention it earlier because the topic was constrained by build. The MLGS doesn't have great use outside of high-level builds.

Iirc, GSOA R2 has a huge windup. It's like clay R2 but hugely watered down. You're bound to be BSed before you finish. :s

It's also tricky to bs a DSS user; due to the range of the weapon, they will usually have stunlocked you by the time you get close enough for a backstab which allows them to roll away and repeat. Charging in for a BS against a spear user usually isn't a good tactic anyway. Even more so with the phantom range of the DSS. I take damage when I'm nowhere near them, even when there is no evident lag.