Could the Flame be the SUN?

Acidic_Cook wrote:

Even now, there are only embers, and man sees not light, but only endless nights."

Fire still exists, however everything is still night. Man uses bonfires at the night in reality to see and also to survive better than to wander in the Darkness.

THe Endless Nights is reminisant to the fact that the Lord of Sunlight is absent, as one became a firekeeper while another had left Lordran (God of War), leaving none to hold the torch of being the Lord of Sunlight.

Look at Gwyndolin, Seath, Priscilla, Four Kings, Nito, and other bosses as well as the domains they hold and the creatures and power they weild in this world... they are rather Dark that Light, and even the Chaos world is Darkness only light by vast amount of fire. Only a few specific places have light remaining... a few specific places.

Sunlight is only seen a few places in this world... Miracles that use to be the powers of such Gods such as Gwynevre, Gwyn, and the God of War... with the Miracles being one of the rarest Spells to Obtain, and one of the most restrained as well to Covenant Specific (Sunlight Spear and Healing Sunlight Miracles past Replenishment).

Acidic_Cook wrote:It's doesn't really matter, really.

Of course, you should look and see why lightning is so closely linked to the Sun, instead of fire.

SEANB240 wrote:I think this is a pretty interesting theory. I wonder if, by the sun fading/being extinguished, would the moon's power also fade? Maybe the Age of Man in darkness would actually be an age of magic, should the flame go out and everyone starts utilizing just moon-based magic, if the moon does keep its power.

If the first flame is in fact the sun, though, it going out wouldn't extinguish all life. We know dragons were around before it and I'd venture to say the Primordial Serpents were around, too.

Shkar wrote:
The Serpents, maybe, but depending on how you look at it, there is every possibility that the flame existed from the very first moment of time. If the dragons existed "before the flame", they wouldn't be alive. The flame CREATED life. That's like saying that dinosaurs existed before there was mass in the universe.

In the Age of Ancients,
The world was unformed, shrouded by fog
A land of grey crags, archtrees, and everlasting dragons

But then there was Fire
And with Fire came Disparity. Heat and cold, life and death, and of course... Light and Dark.

SEANB240 wrote:

Shkar wrote:
The Serpents, maybe, but depending on how you look at it, there is every possibility that the flame existed from the very first moment of time. If the dragons existed "before the flame", they wouldn't be alive. The flame CREATED life. That's like saying that dinosaurs existed before there was mass in the universe.

In the Age of Ancients,
The world was unformed, shrouded by fog
A land of grey crags, archtrees, and everlasting dragons

But then there was Fire
And with Fire came Disparity. Heat and cold, life and death, and of course... Light and Dark.

The first flame created the gods and men, but dragons (and the Serpents, methinks) were around from the beginning. It is like that cycle found so often in history, Mythical Age (creation, often from a primordial, abyssal void already inhabited by...things) - Age of Heroes (Gods and humans) - Historical Age (humans).

Shkar wrote:

"There were good guys, but then again, there were great guys as well."

"Then" doesn't mean the flame came later. I will admit, it seems like it does, I won't argue that. But since life and death came with the flame, that would mean that the dragons and the archtrees are neither alive or dead. With no heat or cold, that implys that either there was no temperature at all (no matter), or that everything was a single temperature, which wouldn't be possible with things moving.

Then, from the Dark, They came,
and found the Souls of Lords within the flame.

SEANB240 wrote:

Shkar wrote:

"There were good guys, but then again, there were great guys as well."

"Then" doesn't mean the flame came later. I will admit, it seems like it does, I won't argue that. But since life and death came with the flame, that would mean that the dragons and the archtrees are neither alive or dead. With no heat or cold, that implys that either there was no temperature at all (no matter), or that everything was a single temperature, which wouldn't be possible with things moving.

No doubt, those things aren't "alive" in the sense that the humans and gods are. I do think, though, that the "then" in this case is temporal, but I could definitely see it your way as well.

Then, from the Dark, They came,
and found the Souls of Lords within the flame.

I think this line is pretty interesting and relevant to the earlier discussion about Gwyn inheriting his title, rather than originating with it. He wouldn't have been born the Lord of Sunlight if he had come from the Dark, or at least, that wouldn't make a lot of sense.