A serious can of worms. Namely, the new "bbg"

I think the fact it's in the PvP section only further proves my point- everyone just thinks it's a tool for pvp, not griefing :| (I don't really count griefing as pvp as it's not a contest, more of a sentence to lose your enjoyment)

I see your point, Spam_much. I personally do not like this exploit.

However, I find its potential to be used properly very beneficial, therefore I use it. I also plan to make several anti-grief builds for co-op.

Truly, there must be made a covenant dedicated to this act. Fighting the "good fight" against griefers.

EeAyEss wrote:Truly, there must be made a covenant dedicated to this act. Fighting the "good fight" against griefers.

There was, just noone actually gave a **** and just went on using their nice easy-bake oven made characters for SL120 pvp while this covenant failed to attract members:

https://soulswiki.forumotion.com/t7102-nightwatch?highlight=nightwatch

It was the first ever user covenant, glad to say I helped make it. Sadly It never took off. Why? People are quick to say they dislike griefing, but less so in actually doing something about it.

Griefers have existed for a long time and there will always be griefers.
When we first started, we too suffered from griefers and had to farm for our own stuff because most of us didn't even know about those glitches.

Even so, look where we are now. I honestly don't think that this will scare away new players. BB Glitch didn't scare away new players back then too. If they were that frightened, then DkS just isn't the game for them.

With every exploit, there's always a negative side that players will manipulate for bad reasons. That's why as a community, we need to have the responsibility not to abuse it for the wrong reasons.

Automancer wrote:
With every exploit, there's always a negative side that players will manipulate for bad reasons. That's why as a community, we need to have the responsibility not to abuse it for the wrong reasons.

The problem is, laziness is more of a wrong reason than a right one.

I never understood the whole "skip out playing the game so I can play it more" thing, it's a complete oxymoron. Just play it or dont. If you don't like playing through it, then you shouldn't.

If people resorted to anything else- "I'm on benefits because I'm too lazy to work", "I drove 2 minutes because I was too lazy to walk", "I didn't do my work because I couldn't be bothered to put the 5-10 hours into it".. Yet when people say it about souls it's suddenly completely acceptable? My mind boggles.

Thats pretty much why if I ever get bored of playing souls through, I stop and come back to it when I'm interested again.

Then just play it the way you want. You can't stop others from doing so.
I understand that you have your own opinion on this but that isn't the case for others. I personally rarely have the time to play. When i'm on the forums, it's before i go to work, when i'm having a lunch break at work or when i get back.

I don't have the time to do as much PvE as i used to nor do i have the interest in doing so. I've played PvE since it came out and i'm totally spent so my focus has shifted over to PvP. So making a new build from scratch and farming everything isn't time efficient.

Yeah I love playing souls. I don't always love farming 3000 dark wraiths for one more slab. Or beating Pikachu and Snorlax on NG++ just for some more casts of spells.

I want to PvP. If I wanted to PvE there would be no problem. The problem is theres 12 hours of PvE standing between me and the PvP I want.

I'll say this once very clearly. Farming Phalanx to level up BOTH of my Pyrogloves to max is not an Engaging, challenging or useful way for me to spend time. I know I can do it, anyone could do it it doesn't prove anything. It just sucks minutes and hours out of my life that would be better spent using my REO.

I'm not lazy, I've logged a ridiculous number of hours. I have a maxed out level 1 (no bbg) and level 2(I wanted 10 dex sooo bad) I have 100s and 120s from post BBG era with 4 stacks of WoG or the super ******* 5 casts of Dark Bead (my forest bro)

http://mugenmonkey.com/darksouls/?c=392284544773378220

Oh look a build I've never used before. Boy it sure looks like FUN smashing into someone with a SLB DGM. Too bad I don't have 9 hours today to make it and test it so I'll never know if I really enjoy it or if its even viable.

I think the biggest problem though is the fact people seem to go to excess with their builds in what they say it 'needs'

on your PvP build needs 4 stacks of wog or 5 of dark bead, 2 pyro gloves? there's no advantage to 2 maxed gloves.. Why do you need them? you don't really.

why do you need to farm for slabs? you only need one +15 weapon and difference between top level and one below is 20 AR. 20, seriously.

I'm sorry, but the extra hours farming for unnecessary stuff like that doesn't really count in my eyes, and doesn't make me have any sympathy. If you like PvP as much as you say you do, then you're probably good enough to play and win without having every single weapon and piece of armour fully upgraded.

I also don't get the whole thing about literally 'needing' to make new builds. Like seriously just use different weapons on the ones you have or something, with like 4-5 builds you can cover most PvP specialties.. I bet both of you have had builds into the double figures..

Oh yeah I've PvPed on double digit builds THIS WEEK.

Yeah I Could use the DGM on my BKGA build. but I've wasted 8 points into Dex at that point, AND it's a bit heavier so I'd want those points in END so I can wear armor.

When I'm hosting in the forest I do NEED an exorbitant number of casts, because I plan on being in there and alive for quite a long time without resting.

I would never use a +14 without the intention of making it +15. There is no reason not to get the most out of everything you can. And if 20 AR doesn't matter to you, then fight be where all your weapons get -20ar and all mine get +20ar because it doesn't really matter does it? (Except it does matter it makes you do more damage)

Eh, i really can't be bothered to convince others when they're too headstrong about their own opinions. You play it your way, we'll play ours.

I'm having fun and no one is going to stop me.

EeAyEss wrote:Serious, since you mentioned need, do we really need to play this game?


We want to PvP to our highest potential, and we like having optimized-to-hell builds. Sure, we can win without maxed out gear. I do that often enough, but, like I said, a lot of us enjoy having optimized-as-*** builds.

Well, the way some people talk about it it seems they have an underlying addiction to PvP, which shines through in the way that not getting to PvP quickly and having to PvE irks them so damn much! Anyways..

Thing is, the optimisation doesn't even make much difference- jansports talking about 8 points of wasted dex... For using DGM.. that thing 2-3 shots people anyways! you wont miss the points.. I never got this to be honest. My builds are never optimised really, I get a rough iidea of the stats I wanna do and just roll with it, see what armours i pick up along the way kinda work, and just go with it.

Arguably though, if you wanna play the best you can, you should play with a slightly compromised build as you'll become a better player by competing at a disadvantage.

Jan sports- when I pvp and get bored of weapons, i regularly use +14, it's really not that bad, in the grand scheme of things. (my armour is also usually at most +5, i just can never be bothered to upgrade it, you know?) You should try it, hell as i said above, you'll probably become a better player as a result, and rely less on your perfect build, more on your skills. Obviously here I'm not trying to say I'm better than people, Im disappointingly average, with layers of rust on top of that.

Automancer wrote:BB Glitch didn't scare away new players back then too. If they were that frightened, then DkS just isn't the game for them.

I actually have a friend who sold his Dark Souls copy and only plays Demon's because he was tired of all the glitches and griefing. He loves Demon's too, it's really too bad...

Animaaal wrote:
Offline build testing would ruin pvp in the long run, I hope DkS2 has nothing to do with it.

How you gonna PvP offline?

I'm with you serious, i never entirely upgrade my gear, now i do get all my gear to +14 or +9 for armor but never maxed out, now if a DW drops a slab while i'm farming for chunks then sure i'll upgrade my armor fully, but that's about it.

And honestly, i don't lose very often. I consider myself average or slightly above average tier in the Serious PVP, and i don't even mind it.

DemonOfFate wrote:I consider myself average or slightly above average

Dunning & Kruger would like a word.

DemonOfFate wrote:And honestly, i don't lose very often. I consider myself average or slightly above average tier in the Serious PVP, and i don't even mind it.

If you don't lose very often, you are either top tier, or fighting sub par invaders.

reim0027 wrote:

DemonOfFate wrote:And honestly, i don't lose very often. I consider myself average or slightly above average tier in the Serious PVP, and i don't even mind it.

If you don't lose very often, you are either top tier, or fighting sub par invaders.

Maybe he uses weapon buffs? That definitely moves it in his favour..

Or he uses a very easy to use build such as a long spear? Or a build that has like GC, wog, dark bead etc for easy to use health annihilation?

DemonOfFate wrote:And honestly, i don't lose very often. I consider myself average or slightly above average tier in the Serious PVP, and i don't even mind it.

Unless you are top-tier or using easy tactics, you will lose a lot. So no, just no.