That is the exact opposite of attempting to introduce more balanceBloodTempest wrote:Why not give those wearing light armor quicker recovery time so that they can't get stunlocked by claymore or zweihanders?
![big grin](/users/3116/20/11/10/smiles/2183680451.gif)
That is the exact opposite of attempting to introduce more balanceBloodTempest wrote:Why not give those wearing light armor quicker recovery time so that they can't get stunlocked by claymore or zweihanders?
Ok, imagine fighting against a spear turtle with shield deflection.Soul of Stray Demon wrote:Ok, what about introducing deflection as a mechanic for pvp, It's crazy a tiny dagger can hit a greatshield in pvp, but a big greatsword can deflect in pve. So they could do armor deflection too, for the very very heavy armors.
Every fight against someone that used Iron Flesh or the Havel Shield buff? That is pretty much the mechanic you are thinking of. And it really is just a plain stupid idea to melee attack people with those buffs on.Soul of Stray Demon wrote:Ok, what about introducing deflection as a mechanic for pvp, It's crazy a tiny dagger can hit a greatshield in pvp, but a big greatsword can deflect in pve. So they could do armor deflection too, for the very very heavy armors.
Since when?Soul of Stray Demon wrote:That's what the heavy weapons are for, shield breakage.
A lot of weapons won't deflect off them when 2-handed. The issue then is of course that you absolutely can't poise race them, either, but simply attacking them and then getting out isn't a horrible idea.SirArchmage wrote:Every fight against someone that used Iron Flesh or the Havel Shield buff? That is pretty much the mechanic you are thinking of. And it really is just a plain stupid idea to melee attack people with those buffs on.Soul of Stray Demon wrote:Ok, what about introducing deflection as a mechanic for pvp, It's crazy a tiny dagger can hit a greatshield in pvp, but a big greatsword can deflect in pve. So they could do armor deflection too, for the very very heavy armors.
I would just prefer for stunlocking to be removed almost if not just entirely. Just making heavier weapons a bit faster in comparison to the faster weapons and perhaps increasing the AR gap would be a better option for balance IMO.Parsify wrote:In my personal view, poise is not a problem, the way a stunlock can be abused against low poise is.
I would implement some kind of combo damage scaling, like we see in fighting games.
For example, today, if you get hit by a heavy weapon and gets stunlocked and your opponent hits you 2 more times, he does 300% damage total, and sometimes this ends in a kill. In my suggestion, the second hit should do 50% base damage, and the third 25%. That way a stunlock would still benefit users of slow and heavy weapons, but the punishment would not be a total disaster.
STAHPSaturday-Saint wrote:If you care more about having viable heavy armor than having engaging combat, why not just play Skyrim?
homelessguy wrote: made from a legendary stone slab that is unbreakable
Even more so, when you upgrade your weapon, you aren't just taping a big slab to your sword.Wilkinson3424 wrote:I'm pretty sure the slabs are breakable.homelessguy wrote: made from a legendary stone slab that is unbreakable
-Cough- Chunks, Shards, Large Chunks, -Cough-
The biggest exploitations in the game have very little to do with tanking. Poise stabs are about the only thing you could claim doesn't work properly, and that's a reach considering all the other BS methods.δelta wrote:STAHPSaturday-Saint wrote:If you care more about having viable heavy armor than having engaging combat, why not just play Skyrim?
@OP :
There was no poise system in Demons' Souls, but the one introduced in Dark Souls is broken beyond measure. It's probably not going, since STR weapons and heavy armor seem to be getting new love in DkS2, but I'd prefer it to be removed, if only to reduce exploitation and tanking.
Break points in general are kind of silly. If you attached poise stun to the amount of damage received it would as much if not more sense; armor reduces damage and big hits cause more damage --> longer stun period.Rynn wrote:Poise should not be a stat, but rather an effect.
I do not care how much armor you're wearing, what causes people to flinch, scream, and groan, is not the act of being hit, but the pain. Clearly if I am injured, I will recoil, and if I'm not, I won't. The question then becomes more of breakpoints for what is and isn't "pain" to the player character. For my tabletop Dark Souls game, I'd concluded that I was going to use 12.5% of current HP as a hard and fast rule, and that certain abilities and capacities the players gained throughout the game would impact this ratio positively or negatively. Poise needs to be reworked but it's not as simple as changing a number I think.
At the very least I don't want this "17, 31, 36, 53, 61, 77" ********. Why does EVERY curved sword do 31 poise? For a long time I refused to believe this was true because it was SO STUPID I couldn't believe it really was correct. I have still taken ages to come to terms with the fact that most dex weapons have a hard and fast rule of 31. Why not have breakpoints of 28-33 for katana's, or to some extent, a random + or - to poise damage done? Why THAT?!
If I may ask, why is poise tied to pain? Simple physics plays a part as well, at least when it comes to very large weapons. Say your character is in full Havel's or Smough's or something equally fortress-like. Even if they couldn't feel the impact, something like a Great Club or Greataxe should still send them reeling due to the sheer amount of force with which one swing would connect. I've always thought it strange that Great weapons didn't universally come with "unpoisable" attacks. Even if not across the board (for obvious balance purposes), at least a good number of two-handed R2s should be untankable with weapons like those.Rynn wrote:Poise should not be a stat, but rather an effect.
I do not care how much armor you're wearing, what causes people to flinch, scream, and groan, is not the act of being hit, but the pain. Clearly if I am injured, I will recoil, and if I'm not, I won't. The question then becomes more of breakpoints for what is and isn't "pain" to the player character. For my tabletop Dark Souls game, I'd concluded that I was going to use 12.5% of current HP as a hard and fast rule, and that certain abilities and capacities the players gained throughout the game would impact this ratio positively or negatively. Poise needs to be reworked but it's not as simple as changing a number I think.
At the very least I don't want this "17, 31, 36, 53, 61, 77" ********. Why does EVERY curved sword do 31 poise? For a long time I refused to believe this was true because it was SO STUPID I couldn't believe it really was correct. I have still taken ages to come to terms with the fact that most dex weapons have a hard and fast rule of 31. Why not have breakpoints of 28-33 for katana's, or to some extent, a random + or - to poise damage done? Why THAT?!
I always thought the reason you could poise through the heavy weapons, was by weight. That was my belief anyway, that it would hold you down, and keep you balanced.Reaperfan wrote:TheMeInTeam wrote:If I may ask, why is poise tied to pain? Simple physics plays a part as well, at least when it comes to very large weapons. Say your character is in full Havel's or Smough's or something equally fortress-like. Even if they couldn't feel the impact, something like a Great Club or Greataxe should still send them reeling due to the sheer amount of force with which one swing would connect. I've always thought it strange that Great weapons didn't universally come with "unpoisable" attacks. Even if not across the board (for obvious balance purposes), at least a good number of two-handed R2s should be untankable with weapons like those.Rynn wrote:Poise should not be a stat, but rather an effect.
I do not care how much armor you're wearing, what causes people to flinch, scream, and groan, is not the act of being hit, but the pain. Clearly if I am injured, I will recoil, and if I'm not, I won't. The question then becomes more of breakpoints for what is and isn't "pain" to the player character. For my tabletop Dark Souls game, I'd concluded that I was going to use 12.5% of current HP as a hard and fast rule, and that certain abilities and capacities the players gained throughout the game would impact this ratio positively or negatively. Poise needs to be reworked but it's not as simple as changing a number I think.
At the very least I don't want this "17, 31, 36, 53, 61, 77" ********. Why does EVERY curved sword do 31 poise? For a long time I refused to believe this was true because it was SO STUPID I couldn't believe it really was correct. I have still taken ages to come to terms with the fact that most dex weapons have a hard and fast rule of 31. Why not have breakpoints of 28-33 for katana's, or to some extent, a random + or - to poise damage done? Why THAT?!
I also agree. Preferably certain attacks should never be poised simply by design. It's not as simple as just saying "12.5% HP", but 12.5% HP is a lot better than just a breakpoint*Reaperfan wrote:TheMeInTeam wrote:If I may ask, why is poise tied to pain? Simple physics plays a part as well, at least when it comes to very large weapons. Say your character is in full Havel's or Smough's or something equally fortress-like. Even if they couldn't feel the impact, something like a Great Club or Greataxe should still send them reeling due to the sheer amount of force with which one swing would connect. I've always thought it strange that Great weapons didn't universally come with "unpoisable" attacks. Even if not across the board (for obvious balance purposes), at least a good number of two-handed R2s should be untankable with weapons like those.Rynn wrote:Poise should not be a stat, but rather an effect.
I do not care how much armor you're wearing, what causes people to flinch, scream, and groan, is not the act of being hit, but the pain. Clearly if I am injured, I will recoil, and if I'm not, I won't. The question then becomes more of breakpoints for what is and isn't "pain" to the player character. For my tabletop Dark Souls game, I'd concluded that I was going to use 12.5% of current HP as a hard and fast rule, and that certain abilities and capacities the players gained throughout the game would impact this ratio positively or negatively. Poise needs to be reworked but it's not as simple as changing a number I think.
At the very least I don't want this "17, 31, 36, 53, 61, 77" ********. Why does EVERY curved sword do 31 poise? For a long time I refused to believe this was true because it was SO STUPID I couldn't believe it really was correct. I have still taken ages to come to terms with the fact that most dex weapons have a hard and fast rule of 31. Why not have breakpoints of 28-33 for katana's, or to some extent, a random + or - to poise damage done? Why THAT?!
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